Is there a pool pump fitting adapter to stop this incessant leak?

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On Fri, 03 May 2013 14:17:00 -0700, Oren wrote:

UPDATE (without IMG tags): Yesterday, in the hour left between arriving home and mosquito darkness I tried to cut the pipes using my new pipe-cutting tool, but it broke on the very first attempt:

So I hacksawed the outlet of the filter pump at the elbow:

And, I hacksawed the inlet of the filter pump at the midway point:

Removing the wires from the wiring conduit elbow was problematic:

Crazily twisted and cracked 10AWG wires are always the result:

By nightfall, I finally had the room to repair the leaks and relocate both the filter pump and the cleaner pump and figure out where to put the pipes so that I can more easily maintain the equipment yet not to introduce too many additional bends (some day I'll convert the whole thing to curves):

Surprise!
When I sliced the pipe at the Jandy valve of the filter pump a bit closer, I realize there was thick (schedule 200?) gray pipe:

I called the pool guys who said that their service men use that gray schedule 200 because it's thicker and stronger than PVC schedule 40.
Do you know if there is any truth to that statement which implies I shouldn't use white PVC schedule 40 at the pumps because it heats up and is more brittle than the gray thicker schedule 200???
Anyway, this thick gray schedule 200 pipe should probably be bored out; but I don't have the boring tool:

I called up Jandy (now Zodiac) at 800-822-7933x1x5, and spoke to their technical support, and pointed them to this thread. They said they don't sell the boring tool, and, that the 2.5" coupling should work.
Back at the now-removed pump, I was worried the filter pump inlet threaded coupling would be glued in from all the repairs - but it spun out easily with an oil filter wrench, of all things:

Here you can see all the caulk and pipe dope in the world was really useless because none of it penetrated to the threads themselves:

However, it can be seen that there certainly was teflon tape used in the original fittings:

And, now I'm ready to put it all back together in a leak-free yet maintenance friendly way:

I hope ... (I've never done this before) ...
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Probably because the old pipe has been sitting outside for many years and has gotten hard, while new PVC is softer. I've never used a knife type cutter on 2" or larger pipe, so don't know how hard it really is. I've always used a hacksaw for those sizes. But your experience is a good lesson for all.

Can't you push/pull out those wires through the elbow one at a time? If necessary, you could even cut off the terminals then crimp new ones on later as long as you have 3/8" or so of extra wire. Looks to me like you should be able to get those wires out without destroying them. When you do the re-wiring, leave some extra free wire.
Also, can't tell from the pic, but is it possible that a better way to wire it would be to bring the wires straight into the motor behind or on the sides of that terminal block, then make a u-turn and come back? If you could do that, then you could have several inches of wire to work with, can straighten it out, have it go straight back into the conduit, instead of making that sharp immediate turn to the terminals it now has.

I don't know what that is. It looks like a pipe over a bushing to me, not just one piece of pipe. If it's some kind of thicker doubled pipe, why would it be only thick right at the valve, and not where you cut it further back?

Does sched 200 even mate with the fittings you have, ie Jandy valve? Maybe that's what the doubled up looking thing is, some adapter to go from one to the other?

Sched 40 is all that I've seen used here in NJ. And apparently it works, because I haven't heard any horror stories. Are those pool guys from the company that installed it? If so, we know they don't know what they're doing....

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You seem to be doing fine. Carry on....
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They work well for me on PVC up to 1 1/2". Always cuts close to square. Certainly a lot squarer than you can do with a saw.
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On Sat, 04 May 2013 09:53:04 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

You can see the cut ends from these off the pump outlets:

One dilemma was that the gray threaded circled schedule 80 nipple "adapter" didn't seem to exist at two Home Depots that I had visited yesterday.
They said it must be some kind of specialty pool fitting.
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On Sat, 04 May 2013 09:24:28 -0700, Oren wrote:

Well, I'll find out 'cuz I bought a new 2" pipe cutter yesterday!
I realized the new pipe cutter had a latch at the bottom; so, I think the old one was "returned" at one point, by someone else.
Even so, I couldn't find any of the new ones that didn't have that black non-powdery dye-like stuff at the bottom of the white bag though ... (see photo for example):

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On Sat, 04 May 2013 09:24:28 -0700, Oren wrote:

Well, I'll find out 'cuz I bought a new 2" pipe cutter yesterday!
I realized the new pipe cutter had a latch at the bottom; so, I think the old one was "returned" at one point, by someone else.
Even so, I couldn't find any of the new ones that didn't have that black non-powdery dye-like stuff at the bottom of the white bag though ... (see photo for example):

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On Sun, 05 May 2013 20:25:54 +0000, Danny D wrote:

That pipe cutter turned out to be next to useless, btw...
Lesson learned ...
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On Sat, 04 May 2013 12:29:36 -0700, Oren wrote:

You're very observant! You should be a criminal prosecutor!
I had never mentioned that thin steel tubing, and, in fact, since it was rusted on the end where it was bolted to the concrete originally, I lifted it up and moved it off to the side, and had not bothered to mention it.

It's a cheap support for the control panel backboard. The problem is that the bottom had rusted through, so I'll be replacing it, once I'm all done.
Kudos to you for noticing it was out of place though.
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On Sat, 04 May 2013 12:29:36 -0700, Oren wrote:

Here's that conduit in situ, which, of course, I need to replace with something better than it was (because it rusted through):

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On Sun, 05 May 2013 14:43:07 -0700, Oren wrote:

I'm already suffering from scope creep, doing everything "but" the plumbing, which I'm having problems tackling because I'm afraid I'll screw it up - so I'm trying to plan out every step.
But, it's driving me crazy ... I'd better just do it and get it over with as all this worrying about the plumbing is making me work on other stuff instead. (Do you ever do that?)
Anyway, here's my final plan, before actually doing it:

RATIONALE: - I couldnt' get a straight shot to both pumps without going OVER the baskets, which drove me crazy in the original setup - so I refuse to do that (it makes opening the baskets problematic).
- I did get a straight shot for the filter pump; but it's very close to the filter so the motor may get dripped on if the filter weaps.
- I have a couple of elbows in the cleaner pump, and neither the inlet or outlet is a straight shot, unfortunately.
- There are couplings all over the place; so I can take stuff apart.
- I'm replacing all the fittings that I could find replacements for at Home Depot - but some I just couldn't find - so I'm re-using them.
- For now, I'm going to leave the mineral exchange thingey in place, as I just don't want to rip up too much (that's always my problem --- scope creep!).
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The only issue I see is that on the one pump you appear to be adding one union to the one that is already there. And you're doing that by taking half of a new union and mating it with half of one of the old unions. IMO, that *might* work or it might leak all over the place. I'm not sure that all unions are designed exactly the same so that they can mate with half of any other union. Also, the seal in the old one is how old now? I would get rid of the existing one and replace it, winding up with just one. I guess if you try it your way and it leaks, you could go back and do it the other way later.
Also, I'd move the union on the pump on the left over to the pipe section closer to the pump so the pump comes out with less piping on it.
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On Mon, 06 May 2013 06:12:20 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

Again, I'm impressed with your visual acumen.
That's exactly what I was doing. I didn't want to cut off the old union (which is 1 year old) but I also didn't like it where it is (I wanted it closer to the pump).
Also, I just realized I probably want the unions on a straight shot into the pump, so that I might more easily tighten them if they leak again, as they did in the past.
So I will see if I can accommodate all your good suggestions.
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On Mon, 06 May 2013 11:50:06 -0700, Oren wrote:

Yes. I will sandpaper the black to white.

Hmmm... I have the purple primer. Is that what you mean? (I don't know of any other PVC cleaner ... )
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On Mon, 06 May 2013 13:08:08 -0700, Oren wrote:

Long story. For others reading this, see this thread: * Question just about the order of pipe dope sealant and teflon tape http://tinyurl.com/cuterno

Done!

This is my first plumbing-rework job, which had simultaneous criteria.
Results: 0. I was able to save all the Jandy valves (which also saved draining the pool!). 1. I eliminated three 90° elbows & added back one 90° & one 45° elbow for a net halving of the number of elbows. 2. I also eliminated a pipe running inconveniently directly over the pump basket cover (which had made it hard to remove the cover). 3. And the unions enable the pumps to be removed easily, and even swapped in an emergency (by carefully matching the inlet pipes and unions by length & location). 4. Of course, I hope that I eliminated the leak at the two pump inlets (but, now if they leak, they'll be easier to repair!). 5. And, the electrical junction box I'm going to add will make removal of the motors vastly easier (especially with the straight-through waterproof conduit ends).
The trick to saving the Jandy valves (and not draining the entire pool), was to cut off the pipe *at* the Jandy valves:

And then to put an oversized 2.5-inch fitting over the outside of those already used Jandy valves:

Inside that oversized fitting, I put a 2-inch reducer bushing:

And, attached to that reducer bushing, I added a 2-inch union:

In addition, every schedule 40 and schedule 80 fitting was tightened only hand tight plus two turns to decrease strain on the female fittings.

Note: It turns out that schedule 80 fittings don't increase strength but I had to leave some of those sch 80 nipples in place due to their custom nature.
Also, since Teflon tape is deprecated in schedule 40 PVC plumbing, I removed all instances of Teflon tape, using only non-hardening PVC sealants.

One problem I ran into was that the filter itself seems to have proprietary Sta-Rite fittings on it, which weren't available at Home Depot, so, I had to re-use the filter fittings, cutting off as much of the old pipe as I dared:

In the end, I hope not only is the leak repaired, and the plumbing has fewer restrictions, but also that it will be *much easier* to maintain the plumbing what with the unions and extra space afforded by the re-piping.

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On Sat, 04 May 2013 13:02:04 -0700, Oren wrote:

The 2" conduits don't come out from the block wall. The come up from the ground, all in a single tight line. Probably done with some fancy professional pipe-fitting software! :)
Here's an ugly shot of 'most' of the pipes (it missed the solar pipes):

From left to right: 1. Spa jets in 2. Spa jets out 3. Filter in (spa) 4. Filter in (pool) 5. Cleaner in (pool skimmer 1) 6. Cleaner out (pool floor jets) 7. Cleaner in (pool skimmer 2) 8. Filter out 1 (spa) 9. Filter out 2 (pool) 10. Filter out 3 (permanent popup cleaner sprays near the deep end) 11. Unused vacuum cleaner pipe (no pump attached but goes to middle of pool) 12. Solar in 13. Solar out
Since these are all basic tasks, I would think most (self-cleaning) pools would have similar plumbing - but I must admit - this is the only pool I know; but most people who looked at it told me the wrong thing (e.g., about how the skimmers worked, which, it turns out, are wholly unfiltered!).
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On Sun, 05 May 2013 14:34:24 -0700, Oren wrote:

I'm still confused, because I don't know of any electrical flex conduit going nowhere...
Do you mean this electrical panel and the pool controller box?

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On Sat, 04 May 2013 09:09:32 -0700, Oren wrote:

Turns out that is a super duper deluxe thingey!

I'm told it's supposed to kill bacteria, if you bother with the $100 super duper fancy special cartridge:

The problem is that it apparently really isn't needed but it clutters up the outflow from the pool filter:

In fact, it even has an ORANGE restrictor, hindering flow:

So, I just recently dug out that restrictor, and, I'm seriously contemplating removing the whole thingey, whatever it does:

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On Sat, 04 May 2013 09:09:32 -0700, Oren wrote:

Yeah, they had a LOT of pipes inside of pipes!
And, they seemed to use a LOT of that thick gray stuff.

For example, look here and you see what appears to be a schedule 200 nipple epoxied onto the end of the pipe, instead of a standard schedule 40 coupling:

I'm going to have to re-use that because Home Depot didn't have any equivalent end fittings.
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On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 19:23:54 +0000, Danny D. wrote:
UPDATE:
The wiring was revised today, after taking in most of the input from the a.h.r team.

All the wire ends were cleaned up, with new spade connectors, and waterproof wire nuts with di-electric grease on all connections:

The motor sides were cleaned up also, with all new spade connectors:

Smoke test will be tomorrow as it was well after dark when I finished.
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Looks good! Good luck with the test.
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