Home Depot Latex Paint ...very poor coverage

[Ed Pawlowski]

I've taken issue with CR recommendations too often and have not read it for many years. Things they found problematic, I found to be features.

[nikki]

They did. I still have a couple of cans of their Lucite brand in the garage. They're at least 20 years old. You need a magnifying glass to see the 'Dupont' name on the label, but it's there.

The paint is still good, too.

[gregz]

Last batch I ordered the paint with the primer included in the paint. Costs more, but I got away with one good coat with the roller. Never did that before on interior walls. Glidden started adding the primer and also jacked up prices.

Greg

[Stormin Mormon]

Repaint, and thin no more. (punch line from a VERY old joke.)

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

.

Use Sherwin Williams best paint And you will not need to repaint again. I have had excellent results with it. WW

[Albert]

White is a helluva color to get to cover properly . Last spring I used three different high- end whites on one interior job trying to get coverage in 2 coats -Behr ( Home Depot ), Private Estates from General paints , and a Benjamin Moore product ( not Aura ) ...two of them WITH a white latex primer first . In every case , including the primed walls , it took 3-4 coats of product . I knew it would be an issue ...but didn't expect it to be this much of one . Luckily I charged by the hour and didn't quote first.

[Mayayana]

You say it took 4 coats but you didn't say what color was on the walls originally. I can't remember the last time I needed more than 2 coats. I think it was with K-Mart paint some years ago, painting off-white over avocado.

I normally use Benjamin Moore non-Aura (and non-"select" if I can get it) or Sherwin Williams. I like Pratt and Lambert better, but I can no longer get that.

Home Depot is not a paint store. Even if they carry a name brand there's a good chance it won't be the same product or even the same product code that other stores sell. They'll use their clout to bargain for a good deal. In short, if you want good paint then go to a paint store and don't expect it to be a cheap as Home Depot. Also, thinning paint for poor coverage is a good way for paint companies to save money. More coverage means more solids. Titanium dioxide is not cheap.

On the other hand, I used some Behr wall paint recently because someone else bought it. It was supposed to be eggshell but it wasn't. It was much too glossy. It was also drippy, like oil paint. Very odd. Yet the coverage was surprisingly good (painting sky blue over off-white) and it settled down nicely. It covered in two coats. Two weeks ago I repainted that same wall with BM's Linen White matte. Again two coats. Again total coverage. I can't imagine what you're doing that it takes you 4 coats + primer to cover a wall.

[Albert]

The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a latex primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is the only paint I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even then it would be 2 coats ...not the ONE they advertise .

[Mayayana]

| The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a latex | primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is the only paint | I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even then it would be 2 | coats ...not the ONE they advertise . |

You said you'd used non-Aura, so I'm assuming you have used Aura in the past. Were you running an experiment this time? Why would you use 3 different paints -- 2 of them cheap brands -- on one project? And why would you put primer over a beige painted wall to cover with white? Primer is for unpainted surfaces, or as a covering flat coat when painting a bright color that has low opacity. White paint has high opacity. There's no point in using primer. (In fact, the newer BM waterborne paints claim to be "self-priming" even over plaster or joint compound.)

I tried Aura once and now avoid it. First, it's grossly overpriced, yet the paint stores push it because they had to buy new, expensive tinting equipment to make the paints with "waterborne" tint. (Presumably BM is also pushing it. Berkshire Hathway bought BM. Maybe Aura is Warren Buffet's bright idea to greatly increase profits with no real change to the business.)

The one time I used Aura was in a bathroom. Blue- green over white. Flat paint. It covered very well in

2 coats, despite going on thin. But the bathroom wall had a couple of glossy drip marks that I couldn't get off. With normal paint that wouldn't have been an issue, but the Aura was so thin, and settled so flat, that the gloss showed through when the wall was viewed at an angle with light from the window washing across it, even after 2 coats! (So the opacity of coverage was good, but the sheen coverage was very poor.)

If I were doing something like a museum wall, with new, perfect plaster and very demanding lighting, then I might use Aura. For most other uses, the subtle stipple texture left by normal paint hides a lot of imperfections while not being noticeable.

With coverage, in general, I've never needed to do more than 2 coats in recent memory. Nor have I seen anything cover in 1 coat. So opacity of coverage is simply not a factor I consider. I always do 2 coats and that's always sufficient. (That's assuming decent paint is used. Not Behr, Glidden, or store brands.)

I try to go for the BM "classic" line when possible. It's a bit cheaper, but I don't care about a dollar here or there. I like it because it's thicker and has more dependable coverage in terms of sheen. But I've been gradually trying to switch over to Sherwin Williams. After about 30 years of using BM I'm fed up with their gradual degradation of quality while also misleading their customers. Some of it is related to EPA requirements, but they just haven't had the best product for a long time. They're also very aggressive about pushing their client stores not to sell other products. (The BM stores that sell Cabot now hide the Cabot in back.)

A good example of BM's dishonesty and downgrading of product:

I used to always use BM Satin Impervo oil on interior trim. The product code for that was 235. With EPA regulations, BM changed the formula without telling anyone. The new code is C235, but the label is otherwise exactly the same. C235 doesn't settle down properly and seems to be softer than 235, which settled down with no discernible brush marks. Then BM made yet another change when they came up with a formula they could sell in all states in gallons. The newest version is Z235. Still the exact same label. Very different paint. Z235 is sort of like the old exterior oil-base solid stain. It spatters easily due to lack of cohesion, has almost no settling at all, and will peel right off if used on a radiator. (It cost me a couple of callbacks to find that out.)

Store clerks that I've dealt with for years were adamant in telling me that 235, C235 and Z235 were not different formulations. Awhile back I also ran into a BM salesman at the local lumber yard. He also insisted there was absolutely no difference and confronted me with a challenge that if I didn't believe him then I must be calling him a liar. Some salesman! Simply put, of course, he was lying. They can't sell 235 or C235 in gallons due to EPA regulations, so it's silly to claim that those products are the same as Z235. But the salesman was really hoping I'd ignore my own experience, despite that being bad for my business, and believe his lie.

With wall paint there's not so much that they can ruin, but they did manage to do it with Aura. (As I said above, I thought Aura's opacity was good, but since I still can't cover in 1 coat that does me no good, and the sheen coverage is a problem.)

I recently did a job with Sherwin Williams wall paint. (Duration matte.) I can't say that I thought it was noticeably better than BM, but it was good.

For trim I still don't have a solution. I could drive to VT and buy Pratt and Lambert Red Seal. That's the only truly good trim paint I know of for interior that's still on the market. But that's a bit farfetched. It would cost about $100/gallon + gas and trip time. I can use BM Advance, but it has poor coverage, it's drippy and it ruins brushes. (The water cleanup isn't really water cleanup.) Currently I'm using Sherwin Williams Pro Classic waterborne alkyd for trim. It's not bad and settles beautifully, but it's very thin; more like a glaze than a paint... I'm afraid the paint technology is just not keeping up with EPA requirements.

[Terry Coombs]

big snip

My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look" exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round .

[trader_4]

I agree. I don't see the need for primer there either. Sounds like a total waste to me.

I haven't used Aura, but BM regular latex is so mighty fine that I can't imagine the Aura is worth the additional cost. IDK what it could do that's better.

I'm using some Behr right now in an off white color that has just the smallest hint of gray in it. I'm just starting, so don't know how it's going to turn out. But I do know that in Consumer Reports testing, Behr has come in near the top in their ratings. I don't remember which specific type of paint it was though.

Well, what do you expect? When the govt limits what you can use, in many cases it will affect the product. A good example is clear coat for stamped concrete. In many states you can't buy the solvent based anymore. The acrylic stuff lasts maybe half as long.

[Mayayana]

| My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look" | exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very | pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because | the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on | bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used | it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round . |

That's a tough one. I don't know what to use outside anymore, either. The linseed oil primer is still pretty good. Beyond that, there's no oil house paint. The only solid oil stain I know of is Cabot's, which seems to attract mildew. Latex stain has no substance to it. Sherwin Williams and BM both have an exterior oil paint sold in quarts, but neither one seems to have the body that exterior oil paint used to have.

Acrylic/latex is fine for siding, but for exposed sills, decks, fences, etc I just don't know a good product.

Someone asked me last summer about painting a fence. I suggested BM linseed oil primer followed by water base solid stain. I figured the primer would seal against moisture and the stain can be re-applied like a whitewash as it wears. But it's an experiment. I'll be curious to see how it wears after 3-4 years.

[trader_4]

I don't know what the big problem is. I painted my house

10+ years ago with MBH solid stain. It worked fine and lasted all those years. Just did it again with BM solid stain. Seems like it's a great product, excellent covering. The least weathered sections got coverage with just one coat. From everything I've seen latex products have worked well outside for decades and have only gotten better as the years go by.

[clare]

Painted the aluminum siding on the house 6 years or so ago using MooreGlo fortified acrylic. Definitely not cheap, but one coat did the job and it looks great.

Grahams Endure/waterborne ceramic paint looks very interesting for exterior trim. Not readily available up here so I have not tried it. Not talking about the "insulating" paint coatings.

I've used ceramic engine enamel and it works pretty good. (on metal engine parts - not my house!!!!)

[Mayayana]

| Grahams Endure/waterborne ceramic paint looks very interesting for | exterior trim. Not readily available up here so I have not tried it. | Not talking about the "insulating" paint coatings. | I'm not familiar with that. Benjamin Moore's matte acrylic wall paint is said to have ceramic "micro-spheres" to make it washable, but other than that it's just a normal, interior, acrylic wall paint. Is exterior "ceramic" paint also acrylic? I looked up Graham's and that seems to be similar to the Moore paint.

[clare]

Definitely a high end acrylic.