home A/C and R-22 - cost per lb

[clare]

to volunteer to have my AC system exploded for science.

LOTS of so-called "drop in replacement" refrigerants are mostly propane. Not that I would recommend using ANY of them on a refrigeration/ac system.

The big problem with propane, in my opinion, is it is a "heavier than air" flammable gas - so if it leaks in your house, and the AC coil/lines are in a asement, the gas may collect rather than disburse, and you have a very real explosion/fire hazard.

Used in an automotive AC system, unless it leaks in your below-grade or basement-connected garage, the hazards are significantly reduced.

If it leaks into the car when you are driving the mercapitan will get you out of the car before it gets dangerous (before it reaches lean explosive limit)

[bob haller]

going to volunteer to have my AC system exploded for science.

s3.newsguy.com...

Imagine trying to explain a AC fire in your hme from a DIY propane gas in AC. Your insurance company will be interested:(

[krw]

going to volunteer to have my AC system exploded for science.

messagenews: [e-mail]...

Here we go again, Haller's insurance insanity.

[krw]

If air could get in, there wouldn't be enough propane to matter.

[The Daring Dufas]

I wonder if anyone has heard of a stoichiometric or near stoichiometric mixture? It doesn't have to be that close but you do need enough O2 and fuel to make a BOOM! The military and terrorists have used fuel/air bombs with great effectiveness. If you pump O2 from your welding tank into your AC filled with propane and overload the compressor until the overload breaker in the compressor windings gets hot enough to trip, you might be a Redneck. You should have two cameras setup, one close and one far away. After it's all over have a surviving Redneck upload the video to Y'all Tube. ^_^

TDD

[trader4]

That's right, it's the low side, but it's still way above atmospheric pressure, so if there is a leak, it's going to leak out. When it gets down to atmospheric pressure, then air could start to get inside. But with a typical pinhole leak, I see refrigerant under pressure getting out. Air getting in is going to be a lot more difficult.

A bigger worst case scenario would be that someone or something slams into one of the lines inside near the furnace, severs it and a pilot light from the furnace, water heater, etc ignites the propane. But you kind of have that potential with dryer gas lines, stove lines, etc too.

I wonder if any codes say anthing about it?

[Stormin Mormon]

How low does the low side of a refrigeration unit go???? Are they not supposed to run somewhere between 40 and 85 PSI??? Not much change of getting ANY air into a system that has enough gas in it to function at all. In fact virtually impossible to get air into anything but an OPEN system (one with a severe leak or one with a slow leak that has existed for a long time - system totally non-functional)

[Stormin Mormon]

LOTS of so-called "drop in replacement" refrigerants are mostly propane. Not that I would recommend using ANY of them on a refrigeration/ac system.

The big problem with propane, in my opinion, is it is a "heavier than air" flammable gas - so if it leaks in your house, and the AC coil/lines are in a asement, the gas may collect rather than disburse, and you have a very real explosion/fire hazard.

Used in an automotive AC system, unless it leaks in your below-grade or basement-connected garage, the hazards are significantly reduced.

If it leaks into the car when you are driving the mercapitan will get you out of the car before it gets dangerous (before it reaches lean explosive limit)

[Stormin Mormon]

Imagine trying to explain a AC fire in your hme from a DIY propane gas in AC. Your insurance company will be interested:(

[Stormin Mormon]

If air could get in, there wouldn't be enough propane to matter.

[Stormin Mormon]

Please explain to me again, that the toothless home owner with the ten big dogs tied out front, using propane for his AC system. That sleeveless, truck driving wonder who calls his wife by blowing the horn on the truck "musical rendition of Dixie" will evacuate to 400 microns, using two stage vacuum pump, digital micron gage, and full flow ports with valve core remover? Is that before he farts a few bars of "anchors aweigh" or after? . Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

. . wrote in message

But if there is air in the system the owner has other problems. That's why a system is "evacuated" before recharging - with ANY refrigerant.

[clare]

The explosive range for propane is relatively narrow (and low) at 2.1 to 10.1% by volume at 20C and atmospheric pressure.

Gasoline is 1.4 to 7.6 BY VOLUME - Stoich is about 14:1 BY WEIGHT.

[clare]

describe (for your opinion of the only possible way) does happen.

Not on a functioning system - most will shut down before that happens because that means a very low charge. Perhaps some home units may get that low - I don't have much to do with them - but I've never seen an automotive system get anywhere NEAR that low.

[clare]

OK Smartass. Mercaptan. You've never mis-spelled a word? Ethyl Mercaptan - the odorant in propane and natural gas

[clare]

pounds of propane.

Any idiot who will fill a leaky system without evacuating and repairing it deserves to have his double-wide join the international space station in orbit. Propane or not.

Good start for the Darwin awards.

[clare]

Which is why in Canada it is technically illegal to open a refrigeration system without a licence - which requires training.

Used to have mine for automotive AC but let it lapse many tears ago.

[The Daring Dufas]

That's what the fuel/air delivery systems in gasoline engines strive for. ^_^

TDD

[Stormin Mormon]

[Stormin Mormon]

Perhaps some home units may get that low - I don't have much to do with them -

[Home Guy]

Are you just clowning around, or have you really never heard of mercaptan?

It's what they add to natural gas to make it smell like rotten cabbage so you can smell gas-line leaks.

They apparently also add it to refrigerant-grade propane.

And by the way, propane is apparently approved for use in commercial refrigeration plants.

The way things are going with the drive to increase energy efficency in consumer devices and appliances, it's really only a matter of time when residential AC units are going to start using propane. I mean jesus christ - natural gas is already being pumped into and combusted in millions of homes, in furnaces, water heaters, stoves, dryers. It's not like we don't know how to handle flamable gases in residential appliances.

The amount of gas circulating in a residential AC system is a pittance anyways, and anything short of a burst pipe is not going to be a hazzard.