John, I think you're one of the few people in this thread to
appreciate that this ultra fine dust is exactly what I, as OP, am
having problems with.
From all the suggestions I find that the best way (and it's not
great) is where I use a small square of filter-bag material in
between the hose and attachment of a domestic vaccuum cleaner.
All the dust gets drawn in including the fine stuff. The really and
truly fine stuff passes thru the filter material (as a second square
will show) but *hopefully* it gets trapped by the actual dust in the
main vaccuum cleaner bag or by walls of the main bag.
What's left topass thru the bag and then thru the vaccuum's exhaust
filter isn't worth worrying about. The main issue here may be how
fast the main bag gets clogged to the point of being useless.
I guess a Dyson-style vaccuum centrifugal cleaner + HEPA filters
would be better at trapping the dust. (Is this correct?) ANd I was
asking in another group if an el-cheapo £30 Bush DD2227B bagless
Cylinder Bagless from Tesco is any good as I could devote it to this
task. See http://snipurl.com/n6h1
"The Bush DD2227B Cylinder Bagless is a 1200W
cyclonic cylinder cleaner. High level of
filtration. 1.5 litre dust capacity."
As often seems to be the case when you have people arguing that black is
white and vice versa, it usually means they are looking at the problem
from different viewpoints (or one of them just likes arguing!)
HEPA filters certainly trap fine dust (probably better than anything
else you are likely to find), but they are also expensive if you clog
them too fast!
My experience with Dysons is that if you collect fine plaster dust with
a DC01 Absolute for example then you can clog its filters quite quickly
(in fact you may do better without any filters in it). You get least
clogging if you can ensure that you maintain fast airflow through it
(i.e. by not momentarily blanking off the suction pipe as you clean -
something that is easy to do with a crevice tool etc). Something like
the DC14 would be a better bet since has far more suction power and
hence will maintain airflow speed better (it also has much bigger filter
areas). Given the price however I would be reluctant to buy one of these
just for this purpose!
Might be worth a try - you are probably not going to make anything
better at the price!
You could build a pre filter for the task... various folks have posted
details of building small cyclones in the past, including me.
Although my one was not really designed for ultra fine dust collection
however, and talcum powder sized stuff will still go through it into the
vac. You would need one with a proper conical section and lots of air
speed to accelerate the finest particles out of the airflow.
 http://www.internode.ltd.uk/cyclone /
Hmm. that's a nice little project. But the drum (a.k.a. dustbin)
is large. Maybe it needs to be so large for the centrifugal
effect to work.
I'm starting to favour using a pre-filter. The only problem is
that the motor seems to feel it is working against a blockage with
very little air being drawn up the hose. And that may lead to too
much load on the motor itself.
Now I did see a nifty little kit for only £1 for attaching to a
domestic vaccuum cleaner which could then be used to clean a PC.
It had a vented coupling attachment to limit the vacuum suction
ann lower the load on the motor. Something like that might work
well. In fact all that's really needed is to cut some air intake
holes in the vaccuum cleaner extension or hose or whatever part is
Then maybe the trick is to work out the best filter material.
Glass wool would be nice but particles are likely to pass into the
vaccuum cleaner and out through its filter and into the exhaust
air. But maybe a thick enough was of cotton wool or a section of
a vaccuum cleaner filter bag (assuming they are made of a
carefully chosen material to llow air flow but trap dust). Oddly
enough I found that something as simple and unexpected as a few
layers of a J-cloth did a respectable job. Dense fabric like
Egyptian cotton or upholstery fabric might also work well enough.
It would seem that most of these wouls let the sub-micorn stuff
through but in practise they seems to trap quite a lot.
And this method is good for evacuating the drilled hole of debris
while drilling so that a faster cut is achieved and it also
prevents possible clogging when putting in a wallplug.
Smaller cyclones (and ones with more taper) will give more air
acceleration and hence better fine dust removal. The one I built was
more of a chip and sawdust separater - its purpose was to collect all
the granulr stuff and stop the vac getting full in five mins. So in its
current form would not suit what you want.
To get very effective collection of the finest stuff with a cyclone
requires a fair bit of suction and air flow to overcome the resistance
of the cyclone.
It is more of a cooling issue it you eliminate too much airflow. Again
you need to design the prefilter to trade off collection ability against
It does not solve the fine dust clogging the vac problem though does it?
along with the dust. Beware that blow fibre glass shards into the air is
going to do you far more serious harm than the dust!
To catch fine stuff with filters you need a large surface area and a
fairly dense material. Big dust extractors usualy use pleated canister
filters (like lorry / truck air filters), or large felted polyester bags.
Drilling technique can solve those problems usually, see the masonry
drilling section here:
Most vacuum cleaners design for dry use have a direct cooled motor. Any
restriction in the airflow results in less cooling air for the motor and
rapid burnout. A partially blocked filter or hose can 86 a motor in 20
Each time I tried to post, OE told me there had been an error.
After 5 (more than desired, but less than 17) attempts I gave up and decided
to use google groups instead, at which point I noticed that posted had
started to appear.
As well as replying to the groups, I was also CC'ing an email address and as
OE isnt my mail client (I only use it for NGs) the SMTP part isnt properly
configured, so the error was relating to the CCd email address, but the NG
part of the post had succeeded (though it didnt appear in "sent items" as
the email bit had failed.
Maybe you used them all, they are very good afterall ...
Immediately after moving (when I needed to do a few jobs) I could find my
stash, and ended up buying some form my local B&Q - that was an odd feeling
Before we start the "which browser / NG reader" Holy War, I think we should
first agree on an Operating System to run the Chosen One in...
Windows XP or Linux ? (or Maybe MacOS X, now that it will be available for
I've tried quite a few and I'm afraid they really don't work very well,
considering the high cost. That is, they sort of work, a bit, most of the
time. Far better to get someone to hold a vac nozzle just under the drilling
site or - if working alone - to use one of the envelope/bag methods
suggested earlier in this thread.
They are called DustBubbles. We manufacture them here in Hertfordshire (UK),
and they are available in B&Q, and soon to be in Focus and Homebase. They
were in Lowes and Home Depot for a while (but as a 2-man start-up we didn't
have the resources to service the likes of those guys!)
They come in 3 varieties, each one having a different adhesive depending on
- For wallpaper and painted walls (gentle adhesive, will not damage
- For wood, plaster and untreated surfaces (stronger adhesive, will
stick to bare plaster
- For Tiles (the adhesive is non-slip to stop the drill bit sliding
They might sound like the are a novelty, but they work so well that we sell
a "Contamination Control" kit that has been proven (by the UK Health and
Safety Executive) to be sufficient protection when drilling into walls
containing asbestos. We even have versions that can be used on metal which
are being trialled in the Aerospace and Food preparation industries where
swarf contamination is a genuine disaster.
For more details visit www.dustbubble.com
I have some trial packs that contain 2 of each variety listed above.
If anyone wants to try them out for free, email your postal address to
email@example.com (remove the nospam) and I'll post a trial pack
to you, and of course would be interested to hear your feedback...
Really effective dust control devices are expensive, so are not suited
for occasional home use. Even a vacuum (or shop vac) will only get the
larger particles; some dust will get through even the finest filter.
My suggestion for this project would be to have a long hose and a helper
for your vacuum. Remove the bag from the vacuum (to increase suction),
set the vacuum outside, run the hose inside, and let the dust fall over
the yard where mother nature can take care of it. You could even leave
the bag on if you want to minimize the mess in the yard.
David Peters wrote:
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