dicko wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
my objection is that instead of letting the MARKET decide,government forced the conversion,and thus obsoleted my 2 TVs and VCR,"taking" my property without compensation. They will not give coupons for all three receivers in my home,only one coupon per household.
When TracFone's carriers dropped the old analog cellphone service,TracFone sent me a free GSM phone to replace the analog phone.
I should be getting 3 converters at no cost.
innews: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
And more cable systems are being upgraded over time to be digital right to the wall because it lets them cram more channels into the same space.
In the case of systems that provide some basic service without a box, here's what should happen with the end of NTSC broadcasting. The cable company almost certainly will take a std def source for a given channel, turn it into an NTSC compatible signal at the head end and put it out over the cable. That is straightforward, not expensive or hard to do, and causes minimal disruption to their cusotmer base.
And I don't see much choice. In such a system, what would the other alternatives be? Provide the signal in ATSC and expect customers to buy a tuner/converter box? That would be possible for those without a cable box, but it won't work for those that have a cable box. That's because there is nowhere to put the tuner/converter, ie you can't put it before the cable box, you can't put it between the cable box and the TV.
Now, in deference to Pa Pa Peng, who I apologize for jumping on a bit, I can't say for sure what cable companies will do. But I seriously doubt that 18 months from now, there is going to be some big trouble ahead for cable customers that want to continue to use their existing sets and cable. I base this on the following:
1- Considerable thought has been given by the FCC and Congress to minimizing the transition impact. They are giving two $40 coupons to over the air homes to help pay for converters. And it makes sense, because Congress and the Pres can do a lot of stupid things and no one cares. But if your TV stops working, all hell will break loose. All this discussion has been focused on OTA, which today is a small percentage of the total, maybe 15%. It would be pretty stupid for everyone to ignore some impending big problem in cable land, while worrying about OTA. 2- I've seen lots of discussion in various forums over the last few years about the turn off of NTSC, and no one has said anything about there being anything special that needs to be done that is gonna impact consumers. Everyone instead says it only affects folks receiving OTA 3- Technically, it's a simple and easy thing for the cable company to continue to provide an NTSC signal from the head end. Or to continue to provide it as a digital signal out of the cable box.
Sounds like a sales pitch to me. Kinda like doin' the Funky Chicken to dance around the stated Q ("how in the hull do *you* know ...") which you cannot answer.
Sho'ly, sho'ly. The cable co. is famous for taking great pains to precisely define the technologies that they are cramming down their customer's throats. :-)
And, no, I'll not be "researching" any sales pitches in the web.
Premium cable channels with only an NTSC tuner (no set-top box)?
"Steal Yo Mama! And Granma too!!" :-)
I pay for what I get and I get what I pay for. And I'm not buying the super-hyped garbage that you are selling.
He thinks he's "The Oracle On The Mound" and can foresee all eventualities. Doesn't even need to address specific issues (per the above).
I think he's a troll or a spammer or both.
P"Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens!" -Friedrich Schiller
Not a sales pitch. I don't care what you choose to do or watch. Just pointing out that despite your efforts to spread FUD, there isn't some big unknown gotcha out there for cable customers.
Yeah, better to stay ignorant, and cast FUD around instead of making a simple phone call or looking on the web for info pertaining to your own cable company.
Again, not selling anything here.
More FUD about "eventualites". Like the cable companies can't figure out how the turnoff of NTSC broadcasting is going to impact them and how they will accomodate it? And what specific issue would that be that I haven't adressed?
So, you think a std def source looks as good on a 65" HD Display as it does on a 27" HD Display? Many people have bought big HD sets and been shocked at how bad a std def cable source looks that looked fine on their old 27" TV.
To use your terminology, what's so difficult to understand? And it would be a good idea to understand what the difference is. Would be very bad to bring home a a set without an ATSC tuner if you expect to use an antenna. Until recently, that was a very real problem.
innews: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
I'ts two $40 coupons per household to buy ATSC tuners/converters.
snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
Which doesn't do a lot of good for my VCR.
and those converters will cost MORE than the coupon's worth,thus STILL "taking" from me.
snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
You can get satellite TV installed for free in four rooms with individual boxes IIRC. Your monthly service will vary, but I'm pretty sure you can get a basic 200 channel deal with no premium channels for around $30/month. If you're only earning $60/month, you will have trouble mounting a dish to a cardboard box or shopping cart. You must have a slick WiFi setup, hanging out at Starbucks. But seriously... its not THAT expensive.
I have a HDTV and the picture is _very_ impressive, but you can still use your existing TV with either a cable box converter or a satellite receiver, and the unit will convert the new digital TV signal into a less sharp analog signal.
Assuming you buy a digital-capable TV (not a HD TV), you should be able to buy an antenna specifically designed to pick up the new signals. IF you buy a HDTV, only then will you be faced with the dilemma of whether to try and capture OTA HD signals with a HD-designed antenna, or if you spring for the monthly satellite or cable service. Comcast basic cable currently costs about $9.00/month. You'd have to assume when there is no analog signal to broadcast and all they can send is digital and digital HD... pricing might go up a skoosh, but if they try to rip everyone off... yeah, congress will get involved because free TV is like air and votes... both are needed.
I think you should write to both your congressmen and to the Director of the FCC, but its a done deal and has been delayed for about 5 years already.
James... I assume this post was a joke but I figured I'd go along with it.
innews: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
Ineligible if you have cable subscription, even though you also have an OTA antenna. IOW they are not helping out those who use BOTH cable and OTA, only those that use OTA exclusively is my understanding. I use both so I'm SOL.
It's easy to replace a regular TV with a HD TV. If you watch TV at all, the improvement is well worth the cost. I have a plasma TV, but no cable. I have a power HD antennae in the attic that works great. Sometimes the reception is not too good when there are storms so I switch over to a regular broadcast which usually eliminates cut-outs. Or, I watch a DVD. Cable cost would exceed the plasma TV cost in 3 years or less. With an antennae you will need to do some experimentation. I bought 5 HD power antennas, kept the best one, and returned the others. I found that antenna cost has little to do with quality, at least for the ones under $50. That's progress: It's time to trash the rabbit ears.
RickH wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
I don't have cable or satellite TV.Just OTA. Sometimes I have both TVs on,on different channels,and tape a third.
If you have cable,what do you need OTA for? I can see satellite dish TV possibly needing OTA for local channels,but not cable. If you have cable,they will handle the DTV problem with their box. Sat.dish is already DTV.
BTW,how will they know you have cable?
FYI,there's going to be a limited quantity of $40 coupons available before their funds run out. Jan 01,2008,there's going to be a big rush to get your request in the queue.
innews: snipped-for-privacy@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
That vendor appears to be more targeted at pro audio than consumers. There are other vendors selling them today for $75:
There are a wide number of ATSC to USB tuners for PC out there right now that cost $50.
Granted, you will be out some bucks, but it's not nearly as bad as you make it out to be. If you buy 3 tuners in 2009 for $150, get $80 back, you're out more like $70.
Depending on the bitching that starts when most people who are gonna be impacted finally wake up, you may get that before it's over. Personally, I don't see this as such a big deal. There was no great social compact to provide NTSC forever. And compared to other govt taking by various means, this seems small potatoes. How about cases where the loss is major and you get squat? For example, if you own a piece of land where you could legally divide and put up 4 houses, the town changes the zoning and now you can only put up one. That's a huge economic loss to the citizen, easily hundreds of thousands of dollars, and there is zippo compensation.
snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
great. send me the $50. Oh,wait!my old but still usable computer doesn't have USB;(W98 1st edition) So send me a copy of W98 SE,too,and I'll upgrade.
If I don't have it to spare,it is.
That's $70 bucks of MY money that I would have spent elsewhere,on MY choice of goods/services,if I have it at all.Maybe I'll have to go without my medicines,or skip a few meals....maybe my limited budget has been allocated already.
No,but it should have been left up to the consumer market,not arbitrarily decided by government.
OH,-that- makes it OK....
That is a little bit different,as the land owner was speculating on FUTURE development. Zoning rules have been subject to change for a long time,affected by growth and other variables.
It's not like he had 4 houses and was made to remove 3 of them,or that the
3 extra houses (already built) could not be used.It's like you having and using 3 cars,and the gov't comes in and takes away the road to your house(and everyone elses,too),and puts in a bike path[no cars allowed],and says we're giving you a coupon for part of the cost of a bicycle,and that is how you must travel now. Your car has become worthless,unusable.AND you have to take money you would have used elsewhere(if you have it to spare at all),and spend it on a bike.
that is far different than people gradually disposing of their cars on their own choice and switching to bicycles;and then the road being underused,a new bike path put in its place.
I *already have* 3 working NTSC receivers IN USE,the infrastructure supplying them (transmitters,antennas,program sources) is
*already in place*,and now the gov't has said I can't use them anymore. That's a taking without compensation.
innews: snipped-for-privacy@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
Yes, it is a little bit different. But the govt still changed something that directly negatively impacted the guy, and big time. And speculation has nothing to do with it. Any fair appraisal of the property before the zoning change and immediately after would show a substantial change in property value, regardless of what anyone ever intended to do with the property. And not your $70, but perhaps $200K, without any compensation for the zoning change. Or how about the guy that bought a bar, the govt bans smoking in bars, and now the guy's business is down 20%? Or when they banned alcohol in the
20's? Did the govt offer any compensation in those cases, which are orders of magnitude more financial impact? Did I get any compensation when the govt decided to stop the manufacture of Freon, so I wound up having to convert my classic car to R134?You're so wrapped up in your little $70 issue, yet obviously have no empathy for those that are impacted with no compensation at all.
They didn't say you can't use them anymore. The VCR still plays tapes. You can still put a tape in the VCR and watch it on your TV's. And they are giving you $80 is compensation. You may not like it. But even under eminent domain, I've yet to see anyone that was happy with what they got.
Also, what about the rights of the broadcasters, ie the guys that own the transmitters and are the other half of the equation. They had a say in the whole move from NTSC to ATSC and are OK with it. Maybe you should call them up and complain.
SNIP HAPPENS
Cable company customer lists, of course.
On Aug 23, 3:05 pm, jJim McLaughlin >
But.... What if you have a house in town with cable, and a trailer or cabin in the country with OTA? Same name but 2 completely separate locations.
Red
snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
Except that restaurants and bars have had INCREASES in business since the smoking bans.People LIKE to be able to breathe clean air,not come home reeking of cigarette stench. (usually,bars get exempted from the no smoking law,anyways)
All that is still the "ah,that makes it OK" BS.
Ah,but you did not have to convert;AC servicers are still capable of reclaiming and refilling R-12 systems.And your auto AC was *still working* when the R-12 supply was halted. Now if the gov't took your R-12 out of your AC,that would be a different matter.
TVs are important sources of information,particularly with hurricane and disaster notification and public service info. Loss of that is much more than a "$70 issue".
The PRIMARY reason people buy VCRs is to time-shift TV programs,so they can watch them when *they want*,not just when broadcast.
Broadcasters get to write off equipment costs on tax returns. and they already have a budget for equipment upgrades,and they recover their expenses through ad fees.They can increase those fees if they wish.
Smile. Bend over. Grab your ankles. Its the government. (BFG)
I figure the fedss could get from the post ofice a listing, with 11 (yes, there are really 11) digit zip codes, of all residental addresses just like they do for the census,cross that with cable company customer lists , delete all cable company customer addresses and mail coupons to the remaning addresses in the USPS residenses list.
But it really ain't my problem, I don't care how they do it, and I won't play "yeah, but" games with you.
If it's such a big deal, where were you when they took away channels 70 thru 83 and sold them to the cellular phone companies? And channels
60-69 will be gone after the changeover for "emergency services" use. How about when they did away with party line telephones? How about when they forced you to buy airbags, or seat belts, or even windshield wipers on cars? Things change. Get over it. If you can't afford three converter boxes, then you shouldn't have three televisions either. Television, especially color, is a luxury, at least that's what my parent's told me for years. If you need weather warnings and/or news, use a radio... Oh yeah, I forgot, that's going digital as well. Tough luck.As for write-offs, you obviously have never been in business. Equipment and expenditures over a certain dollar value must be DEPRECIATED over the expected life of the equipment. Same thing is true of your old junk televisions. If your house burned down tomorrow, do you think your insurance company is going to pay you what you spent to buy those old junkers? Fat chance, even with a full replacement value policy. You'd be paid for like kind and quality.
The change from analog to digital broadcasting was announced over ten years ago, proposed ten before that, and postponed at least twice. The final date was set by an act of Congress, so if you are that opposed to the change, blame your representative and senators, and vote them out!
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.