I started hearing semiautomatic gunfire about 6:30pm. I haven't heard any bullets land on the roof or vehicles yet. Years back when I had a warehouse downtown, I found a number of 7.62 and 5.56 bullets on the street in front of my place. There were rifling marks on them. o_O
TDD
How many stories like this can happen, day after day, year after year, and you gun-loving fools can say with a straight face that your country is a better place because of your constitutional right to own firearms...
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Posted: Jan 01, 2012 04:19 PM
RUSKIN (near Tampa Bay I guess) ? Diego Duran stood on his family's front lawn to watch New Year's Eve fireworks cut through the darkness, snapping and popping in the air over their Ruskin home.
As the bright bursts of light fell and faded after midnight, a bullet dropped with them.
Diego's mother saw her son collapse to the ground. His sisters and a friend thought at first he was joking.
But when Sandra Duran knelt to check on her 12-year-old son, she became covered in blood that poured from his nose and eyes. She drove Diego to South Bay Hospital in Sun City Center, where doctors found he had been shot in the top of his head. No one knows where the bullet came from, but authorities believe it was fired from miles away in a new year's celebration.
"Here we have a 12-year-old kid fighting for his life because he happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time," said Hillsborough County sheriff's spokesman Larry McKinnon. Detectives spoke with Diego's family and neighbors Sunday morning and determined that no one in the immediate vicinity of the home had been firing a gun at the time, around 1 a.m. Sunday, according to officials.
"The bullet was quite a large one," said family friend Dee Sims. "They said it could have come from 2 or 3 miles away."
Diego was later taken to Tampa General Hospital, where he remained in critical condition Sunday evening. His mother was at his side all day as he lay in a coma, Sims said, the bullet still lodged under his eye.
Sandra and her husband, Diego Sr., have rented a small home for eight years behind Sims' 10-acre farm property. The boy has two sisters, Genesis, 14, and Grace, 16, Sims said. Like his sisters, Diego is an A student. He loves football and baseball and lately has become a fan of skateboarding, she said.
The farming community where they live has its share of gun owners and hunters, Sims said. Celebratory gunfire isn't unusual. "We hear it all the time," Sims said. "I don't know why people do things like that." The firing of weapons into the air in celebration is not an uncommon practice, particularly among immigrants from countries where there are few or no laws prohibiting it.
It's illegal in most states, including Florida. Authorities often remind people not to do it. "Nationally it's a huge issue," McKinnon said. "What somebody thinks is a cheap form of fun and entertainment, it has potentially catastrophic consequences."
Still, it happens.
Last year, a 6-year-old boy was hit and injured by a stray bullet during a New Year's Eve celebration he was attending with his parents at a Miami restaurant. In 2007, a 69-year-old Plantation man was killed in his back yard on New Year's Day by a stray rifle bullet.
A 2006 incident in which two people were shot during a New Year's Eve celebration in Delray Beach led then-state House Majority Leader Adam Hasner to introduce a bill increasing the penalty for firing a gun into the air. The bill did not pass, and the maximum penalty for firing into the air remains a year in jail.
But if someone is hurt or killed, the consequences are much greater. The lethality of a bullet depends on the trajectory at which it is fired, as well as the speed at which it falls. If fired at a non-vertical angle, it maintains enough speed to do damage.
"Some of them go over a mile high," McKinnon said. "Depending on the angle of the bullet, it could come down a couple of miles away."
Detectives want to talk to anyone who might know of someone who was firing any type of weapon into the air early Sunday morning in the Ruskin area. Anyone with information is asked to call the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office at (813) 247-8200.
GEE! You're right, we need to take all guns away from the police because they kill so many innocent citizens. Darn, the military has lots of guns, they kill lots of people, we need to take those away too. Lets see, there are over 300 million of us gun loving nut jobs in The United States so there must be hundreds of thousands of people killed by guns in this country every year and we have to get rid of everything that may take an innocent life. Let me think of all the dangerous items we have here that kill people, hummmm... Darn! It's a very big list, it'll take some time. o_O
TDD
Yup. We need to suspend the constitutionally-protected freedoms of all law-abiding citizens because of the occasional, irresponsible abuses of only a few people. Gee, that makes sense... Sigh.
I think smoke inhalation in house fires kill more people than homicides involving guns. I'm just guessing because I remember home fire deaths being something like 5,000 or more a year and that was when I was doing some work in the field. I recall at one time 40,000 deaths a year due to auto accidents with half of them because of drunk driving. I made a SWAG at the numbers based on past reading but I haven't looked any of it up so any P.L.L.C.F. who wish to scream liar go ahead. ^_^
Oh hell, I looked up some crap anyway!
In 2010, fire departments responded to 384,000 home fires in the United States, which claimed the lives of 2,640 people (not including firefighters) and injured another 13,350, not including firefighters (Karter 2011).
Less than I remembered reading years ago.
Updated 2009 fatality and injury data showing that highway deaths fell to 33,808 for the year, the lowest number since 1950.
Alcohol impaired driving fatalities declined by 7.4 percent in 2009 ?
10,839 compared to 11,711 reported in 2008.Less than I remembered.
As far as deaths due to firearms, the most succinct I could find was at this site:
Heart disease: 616,067 Cancer: 562,875 Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 135,952 Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 127,924 Accidents (unintentional injuries): 123,706 Alzheimer's disease: 74,632 Diabetes: 71,382 Influenza and Pneumonia: 52,717 Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 46,448 Septicemia: 34,828
Where are the hundreds of thousands of deaths caused by gun nuts?
Of course, gun nuts should always be protected by a properly fitted cup inside an athletic supporter. ^_^
TDD
Yea, just like so many of your rights have been taken from you as you partake in air travel.
And note that the TSA is not just in airports. They are expanding their presence on your highways, bus, train and subway stations. You no longer have the right to liberty - which is (in part) the free(1) and anonymous travel within your own country.
(1) by free, I mean free of identity-checking, presentation of documents, searches of your person or property.
Tell me what is more important.
The right to bear arms, or your liberty - the right to travel and move about *in your own country* without the gov't knowing and tracking and sanctioning your every trip.
No, you can't un-do the right to bear arms. Your society is permeated with guns and you can't un-do that. It was a bad decision on the part of the founding fathers to put that in the constitution. You have to live with it now - that is, unless you get shot by a gun and your "right to life" has been taken from you.
The really sad thing is that you all feel that the fate of this 12 year-old boy is a justifiable cost in terms of the over-all benefit you feel that you gain by having the right to bear arms. A gain that none of you can even explain.
What a stupid-ass comparison.
That's like saying old-age kills more people than guns.
A. What was a small child doing awake and in the yard at midnight? He should have been in bed.
B. It's not the gun's fault anyway. It's lack of education on the part of the gun owner. Celebratory gunfire should take place with the gun pointed to the ground, not up in the air.
C. These regrettable negligent acts are the small price we pay for being a free society. Fortunately, they are a vanishingly small price.
D. Interestingly, 110,000 (at least)* guns were bought in the U.S. on December 23rd, 500,000 the week before Christmas, and 1.5 million in the month of December.
Interestingly, it's illegal to buy a gun (as a gift, for instance) for someone else, even a spouse. I would never do such a thing. "Of course the pink revolver is for me, sweetie.".
I wonder why my state (county?) wants to know what guns I have, for the permit. I only told them about one, but...
Yeah, that's only one for every 200 people. Yeah, I'll have to do my part this year but 2011 was a bad year.
In what benighted jurisdiction is that true? There's a difference in intent between a straw-purchase and a gift purchase and, inasmuch as "intent" is a necessary element of every criminal offense, if you intend the weapon as a gift, no foul.
Federal law certainly allows you can buy a gun as a present or to overcome some other disability.
How else does a 12-year old get his first .22? Or his first Barrett 50-cal?
That is a statement born of complete ignorance.
Indeed. Buying a firearm lawfully and giving or selling it to a family member, friend or acquaintance is entirely lawful.
Vermont. I was told it was federal. They told me the same thing here in Alabama. The name on the yellow-sheet was for the end user. I mentioned, both times how silly it was since it was perfectly legal for me to transfer it after. ...and my wife? Oh, she was told the same thing when she said she was going to buy one for me. Nope. No can do. I only assumed it was federal. It couldn't be a Vermont gun law. They don't have any. ;-)
He doesn't. His parents do.
We were told, on at least three occasions in two states, that buying with the intention of transferring it to another person was unlawful. ...even when the other person was in the same family. Ignorance? Maybe. Tell the FFLs.
Look around you. Society is going in the crapper. People are out of jobs. Gangs abound.
What are things like on your planet?
Steve
Don't listen to fools.
From the ATF publication, "Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide"
"An example of an illegal straw purchase is as follows: Mr. Smith asks Mr. Jones to purchase a firearm for Mr. Smith. Mr. Smith gives Mr. Jones the money for the firearm. If Mr. Jones fills out Form 4473, he violates the law by falsely stating that he is the actual buyer of the firearm. Mr. Smith also violates the law because he has unlawfully aided and abetted or caused the making of false statements on the form.
"Where a person purchases a firearm with the intent of making a gift of the firearm to another person, the person making the purchase is indeed the true purchaser. There is no straw purchaser in these instances. In the above example, if Mr. Jones had bought a firearm with his own money to give to Mr. Smith as a birthday present, Mr. Jones could lawfully have completed Form
4473. The use of gift certificates would also not fall within the category of straw purchases. The person redeeming the gift certificate would be the actual purchaser of the firearm and would be properly reflected as such in the dealer's records."Nope. A 12-year old, under federal law, can legally OWN a gun, he just can't buy one. This oddity shows up often when 20-year olds become police officers. Usually, the department buys the gun for the officer.
Actually, stupidity as you demonstrate has killed far more Too bad it hasn't caught up wit you yet But hey, it's a new year
e:
I think the issue here is that the law is being interpreted in ways that were never intended. The law is designed to prevent a straw purchase where someone is buying a gun at the request of another. The simplest solution is for the husband to take the wife to the gun store and have her listed as the buyer and actually pay for it with money that he gave her. That means that the wife has to meet all the reqts for the purchase. Problem solved. What's so hard about that?
ote:
I decided to go look for federal form 4473 which is the actual form the firearms dealer must have completed prior to purchase. The answer to the issue in question is absolutely clear. Under federal law, it is perfectly legal to buy a firearm as a GIFT. It is excluded as being a straw purchase:
From the Q/A contained on the actual form:
It's a totally accurate statement.
That's exactly what the US has become. Can't see the forest for the trees, eh?
You can only get on a plane if you're not on the no-fly list, and you provide gov't issued identification.
You can only get on a plane when you meet all their requirements for carry-on and checked bags, and you submit to an invasive personal search of your person.
Prior to 9/11, you could pay cash for a plane ticket, and board a domestic flight without showing ID of any kind.
I'm not talk ========= You no longer have the right to liberty - which is (in part) the free and anonymous travel *within* your own country. =========
The TSA is operating checkpoints on your highways, bus, train and subway stations. If you don't submit yourself to their questions and searches, you won't be allowed to continue. That's what I call the surrender of your liberty.
So go ahead and polish and fondle your guns all you want -> while your liberty is being taken away from you, one Viper team at a time.
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