If you don't want to make it a permanent installation, another option may be to have a gas outlet like you would connect a grill to and then use a 3/4" hose to connect it to the generator when needed. You can get those hoses in various diameters and lengths, custom made. They are typicall sold for use with RV's, etc.
On 10/2/2012 8:10 AM, HeyBub wrote: ...
There will be a required pressure/volume specification available from the manufacturer of the generator is the easiest/best way to ascertain that for the specific case.
Of course, the upstream feed has to be able to supply all coincident uses downstream is the limiting factor for multiple.
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Good point. But, you'd need a hefty car alternator, or plenty of backup batts, for a 2kW inverter. From
For example: producing a 1500 watt output requires about 217 amperes of current from your car's system. Most stock alternators are in the 80-120 ampere range. A 250 or 300 ampere aftermarket high output alternator should provide enough power for all your car's systems and your high-powered stereo too.
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100 A is only 1.2 kW, while 300 amps would be 3600 W, which is not bad, altho these should proly be de-rated by 20%.So a "standard" car could only accommodate about a 1 kW inverter, altho the battery could up that a bit, and quite a bit ito surges. A high-output alternator could do 3 kW.
Backup batts by themselves are problematic. Amp-hrs are, iiuc, rated over
20 hours, so a typical car battery, at about 50 amp-hrs, yields only 2.5 A, or is good for only.... 30 W !!!! Proly could bump that up to 50-100 W for shorter outages, but even at 100 W, for 1.2 kW, you'd need 12 of them.So a 1,000 W inverter with a battery bank of 5-10 batts is proly not a bad solution, certainly *quieter* than these effing generators. Altho for week-long outages, you'd need a lot of gasoline!
Which brings up the whole risk/payoff/probability issue: Just how much does one prepare/pay for unknown events? Well, lots, iffin yer a survivalist....
For some, a nat.gas powered generator is worth it. For others, proly moi included, this inverter/batt idear seems like an excellent compromise solution, esp. with the cost of inverters coming down. For about $500 in inverters+batteries (+ a trickle charger ), it seems you could have a nice system -- not super powerful, but super quiet, very reliable, no mechanical headaches
I wanted something to keep the shop running, but in the whole risk/payoff scheme of things, it's proly just not worth it, given the improvements in overall svc reliability around here. As I believe I mentioned, a hefty tri-fuel unit is nice, but really a pita to set up properly (even for a diy-er), and very expensive to have done professionally, in most cases proly way more than the unit itself. And did I mention the noise......
One surprising problem, tho, is having 5-10 car batteries hanging around. They can be surprisingly corrosive, need ventilation, etc. Not a super biggie, but a consideration.
Vic Smith wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
This is a really densely populated area in Bergen county, NJ. Even with Irene and with the "Halloween" snowstorm, PSE&G had us reconnected in about 48 hours. That means we were close to but not beyond what was endurable. To make sure that stays that way specifically for our diminishing endurance as we get older, I need ways to combat the cold and keep the fridge going. So a minimal electric supply from a generator, or indeed several space heaters. At the moment I have a propane radiant heater for real emergencies. I would like to get a smallish generator, either gasoline or propane, for that furnace and fridge.
Smitty Two wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news.eternal-september.org:
Thanks for the confirmation! That would be using what is nowadays a rare commodity, common sense. But I'm old enough to consider that SOP!
Right. When I speced it I went with a 200 amp alt, for 2400 watts. For my '97 Lumina with 3.1 that alt is $250. Add ~$250 for that alt, or settle for less watts. Still cheaper, less hassle and more reliable then a generator. With some other assumptions. The devil is in the details. That's why I rejected that too. Like I said, outages are rare enough here that the numbers don't work for any form of backup power. Candles, flashlights, and gas space heat does it for me. Or a trip out of the outage area until power is restored.
Like I said, your furnace might not run with certain generators, and you have the size the generator right for the fridge. Then you have to consider gasoline storage. A lot to consider - and expense - for something that might not even happen. Everybody lives their life their own way, but the strain on the elderly running a f**king power plant in their home should be considered too. If they can drive, can afford a room for a few days, going to an area with power for the duration is probably easier. Some people have hundreds of dollars of frozen food to lose, but that's their life style choice too. I see freezing pipes as the only issue, and just want a heat source. I mentioned cheap gas space heaters. They are safe if installed right, and have thermostats. Set the sucker to 40-50 degrees and get out of town. Anyway, that's my solution. The biggest problem is my dogs. Haven't figured that out.
Restaurant supply houses sell quick connect gas line sets for appliances in commercial kitchens because the equipment often must be rolled away from walls for cleaning. ^_^
TDD
I think you should consider Vic's idea, esp. since you have those low-current HW recirculating pumps.
1500 W inverters (cobra, on google shopping), can be had for $90, altho your alternator will proly put out only 1,000 W. But if you have two cars..... I think a full tank of gas should last a day or two. If you don't run other stuff, it might power a small microwave. Mebbe better here would be a small (600 W) hotplate. But it f'sure would be good for your furnace, fridge, lights, TV's, etc.I'm going to strongly consider this route. My Honda Fit is good for close to 1,000 W, and the pickup truck proly 1500 W. Plus, you'll have an inverter for car trips, if you need 120 V, or some outside jobs requiring AC power.
"Existential Angst" wrote in news:506c888d$0$1237$ snipped-for-privacy@cv.net:
Hay I have a 150 Watt inverter. That might be enough for the 0.76 amp (95Watt) water circulator ...
It is really intended for a computer ... But the idea is worthwhile.
Indeed it will -- plus a 60 W light bulb and a small radio!!
It is. And you can hook up multiple inverters to one car, until the alternator capacity is reached. However, I believe you *cannot hook up the *outputs* of the inverters in parallel* -- you'll have to plug into each inverter as a separate electrical entity. Which is no biggie, cuz "separate entities" is how most people would do this anyway, just giving a heads up to wiseguys like Trader and Shitty2.
Just hook up the inverter(s) right to your car battery, have lots of extension cords.
Another way to do this, which might could save some gas, is to have a second battery outside the car, powering your stuff. When that battery gets too low, hook up jumpers to the car battery (which will then re-power stuff right away), and turn on the car to charge the batteries/supply add'l power. Then, when the batts are charged, shut off the car again.
The more batts you have outside the car, the more efficient this strategy should be. And then when power is restored, recharge all the batts with a Sears charger, and then maintain with a trickle charger. AND you'll always have a spare batt fer yer car.... :)
Maybe he could build a whole freaking battery and inverter farm in his garge and connect it to his car. And he could run the car in the garage, where he knocks himself out after tripping over all those extension cords running all over the place. As he crashes to the floor, pulling the many inverters with him, the wires running all over the batteries short out, adding to the drama for the firemen when they arrive.
As for always having a spare battery, do you think car batteries last forever?
If I were doing this, I'd just buy about a 7KW generator. I'd install one of the Interlockit kits on the panel together with an inlet to connect the generator to. With that and one extension cord, I could power whatever I please in the house.
The starting surge lasts long enough to spin up the motor, so it's a lot longer than a nsec, more like a second. Yes, the electronics in the generator cares.
When we lived in Vermont, the backup heat was a wood stove in the living room. The permanent solution was to move South, though. ;-)
I have no idea, but how much gas would a car use to power the small inverter, vers say a one or two KW generator for a day or two ?
That's a very good Q. Small engines are notoriously inefficient, but then, well, they are small -- visavis a much larger more efficient engine, which is more efficient, but, then, well, BIG!
A small car would do better in this regard, than a large engine. Ideally, a small car with a big-assed alternator. :)
And that's why I suggested a bank of external batts, with the car used to recharge them as nec (while still supplying power to the house). That way, instead of the car engine running all the time (undoubtedly with a lot of waste), when it does run, it's running to produce watts, and not just idling for one light bulb.
But, apparently Trader is too worried about the Fire Dept. and deadly extension cords, to entertain any of these idears.
I doubt my aching joints would allow me live in a Northern climate. O_o
TDD
I guess it's good that the USA includes some temperate lattitudes?
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus
I doubt my aching joints would allow me live in a Northern climate. O_o
TDD
" snipped-for-privacy@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
OK, then I have to have more leeway ... Good to know.
" snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@a7g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
While I could afford to install a 7kW generator system, it doesn't make all that much financial sense to invest 10-15K (including installation by a qualified tech and permits) for something that might happen once a year or once every third year.
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