You can get a 6 circuit transfer box for about 400 prewired from Generac, Lowes gave me one free when I bought a 5500 watt Generac. Best is a transfer box with meters as you can balance the load and its alot safer. Backfeeding has alot of risks for an accident to the generator and you. You can get a trifuel unit, or convert yours.
I have a similar setup with a Generac 5500. It runs the whole house
My generator is a noisy one from HD, Powerboss with B&S engine and generac generating unit. The guys at a Honda dealer actually told me what to look for and told me to avoid Coleman as if it broke down parts would be scarce. We're on acre lots and all neighbors have equally noisy generators. Besides having surge protectors for practically everything, I have battery backup for computers and even put an old deteriorating one on a VCR so I don't have to keep resetting from scratch.
See the same momentary brown out when well kicks on. Similar to lights in kitchen dimming when disposal is used. Watt requirement is highest when engines first come under load. Even so, I've had furnace, well, refrigerator and 2 freezers all running at the same time. I suspect if all came on at once they would pop a circuit breaker.
Something else to consider, is how you balance the load so you dont burn our the unit, its two legs make 220, using only one is not correct, thats where a transfer panel makes it work safely.
Rich wrote:
I've got an 11 HP McCulloch 5100 Watt from Wallmart (FG5700AK), runs my fridge, freezer, gas furnace, most of my lights are on it(CFL's throughout the house), with plenty of power to spare. Bought it for less than $500. I installed a transfer panel kit from Home Depot which ran me $200. This thing starts 1st time every time. The Transfer panel had a defective breaker which tripped well below its rating and wouldnt ever reset. I called the mfgr, Connecticut Electric (which is not in Connecticut BTW, its just down the road in Puyallup WA - go figure...) and they sent me a replacement breaker free of charge. Very nice outfit to talk to on the phone. Back to the generator: I also bought 2 1500 watt electric heaters ($15 each) Each heater has 3 power settings and at the hi setting actually draws a little over 1600 watts. Once a month (or sometimes 2 months) I wheel the generator out of the garage and fire it up for 30 minutes, the 2 heaters provide a good exercise load. Also, I have Stabil in the gasoline (I only use Top Tier gas), the oil is Mobil 1 and I always run the carb dry after using or testing it. Next time, when you turn the fuel back on, you have to wait about 30 seconds before trying to start it, pull out the choke, 1 or 2 easy pulls and Bang! off we go. Oh, one more thing, beware of the microwave, they draw a hell of a lot more on start up than they run at, kinda like a motor. Mines not on the transfer switch. We get frequent power outages here in winter, I have 2 dozen D-cells for my flashlights (florescent lanterns), a coleman stove and a couple small screw on bottles of propane for it, plus the bbq tank is full if i need it. Gasoline is a problem in extended outages so I've learned to head into town early in an outage and if the town is still lit, i can get gas till it runs out due to high demand after about 2 days. I'd prefer to have a NG fired generator (unlimited fuel supply due to my NG supplied by pipeline), but i have what i have and adding a tap to the NG line after the meter is going to be tricky due to short exposed pipe and I sure as hell aint gonna do it myself on something like that, we leave that one to the pro's) plus I'd have to install a conversion kit on the generator. So, the generator is full all the time, and i have a 5 gallon can besides and a siphon hose in my emergency box for getting gas out of my car - close enough. It took me 2 separate week long outages in winter (here its typically
30's/40's and rain in winter)to smart'n up and get prepared, now I'm ready and the last big outage went smoothly, furnace running, fridge cold, coleman stove running - we (My wife and daughter and me) had it good, our neighbors were looking for hotels (with genny's) up to 50 miles away and STILL had problems finding one. Eric
Backfeeding is stupid and dangerous and leaves you wide open to criminal liability. EVEN if its not you, how are you going to prove that it wasnt you who sent a backfed charge out onto the powerline that killed the lineworker? I can hear it now... "Oh i wont forget to shut off the main" Sure, sure. Dont be so stinking cheap, go buy a transfer switch. Eric
I too considered it, it is cheaper than hiring an electrician to install a transfer switch. Just Google around a bit, and you'll see why it is a very bad idea.
The problem is that if you forget to turn off the mains, or if someone else turns them on, or if your box is incorrectly wired, you could kill a utility worker. The transformers will work in reverse to step up your generator current to thousands of volts.
It is against code. You might kill somebody. It is my understanding that you could be held not just civilly liable, but also criminally.
Something else to consider, is how you balance the load so you dont burn our the unit, its two legs make 220, using only one is not correct, thats where a transfer panel makes it work safely.
OK I've been looking at more units and switches and I think I'm going to use my 16HP Briggs engine and get a 5500 watt PTO unit and make the generator from that. Then use the money I didn't spend on an engine to get a transfer switch and set this up properly.
Thanks for all who helped, Rich
Please explain. Do transfer panels do dynamic load balancing?
Boden
The real hazard is to the user and his neighbors.
While we are on the topic.. does anyone have expreience with the generators that are actually DC units with electronic inverters to make AC. That seems like a good idea but I wonder about the surge capability. A regular generator can handle a very large surge load due to it's mechanical interia is used to over come the mechnical interia of the motor it is trying to start. But a gen with an inverter may trip on overload when trying to start a motor. Anybody have experience with this?
Mark
Sounds OK technically. Is bad idea from safety angle; and illegal in many places. Could result in legal and civil liability if someone gets killed. Should be no need to explain why!
Yes. My Honda EU2000i handles start-up surge just fine.
Was planning on it. Before you get upset, look at the critical pats of the construction this time.
Open window, open door, roof vents and an open air fan plus garage door open at least 6 inches (more if rain allows.)
Read the conditions first please. This isnt an enclosed airtight garage. In fact, it is designed that way because of the gas furnace unit.
Once the rain passes, it can go on the back screened porch.
If it helps, we had a free estimate done for an installed unit and asked about this. The installed unit was more than we wanted to pay (about
1,500$). With the back door to the porch open (shielded from the rain) and the side window, major draft. Opening the garage door 6 inches up, windstorm in there.
My 6 circuit Generac has 2 amp meters, one for each leg, you are supposed to wire the apliance loads to balance it as best you can, and monitor it through the amp meters so you can visualy see if you are operating it safely. Im sure expensive multi circuit units are better, but this is a safe way to do it. It is so you dont try to run everything off one leg of the unit, and burn it up.
"ransley" wrote
Interesting! I wouldnt have thought of that aspect. Still havent got one and our circumstances are not the same (no intent to hook it to the house wiring for example) but I'd assume that above would still be applicable.
I was looking at one with 3 'outlets' but some are smaller and have 2. Could be I'd do better with one that has only 2? We've gone a few times without power for a few days in hurricane season (happens about every other year). So far, never lost the freezer load. We keep it's empty spaces filled with frozen water bottles (at least, we do that when a storm approaches). If you dont open it much, it stays frozen for 3 days easy. The one time we needed longer, Ice bags did the trick.
A few years ago, our condo maint. people were operating a generator in the open-air atrium of our building. Atrium is open on four sides, with roof over it. Our AC is at the opposite end of the building from where they worked. We had an old CO detector, no longer used because we have no gas appliances, in a box in the laundry room. There was enough CO given off outside to set off our alarm inside.
I recall reading about one death in Florida because the setting described resembled a friend's home. Had a generator going in their screened-in outdoor room. They woke up dead. :o)
Yup that's the way people do it ... and still die
Do you have CO detectors around the house?
wrote
Yes. And rote answers without listening to the construction involved are not as useful as you might think.
Consider this a 2 wall garage with roof and 2 walls missing and you are a bit closer to the construction.
1 open window and a cracked garage door do not constitute "missing walls."
What you fail to understand is how nasty and dangerous CO really is, and what little it really takes to adversely affect your health for a LONG time, if it doesn't kill you.
And you still aren't listening to anyone here who is telling you that that is how hundreds of people die every year of carbon monoxide poisoning and hundreds more are made seriously ill!!!!!!!!!
ARE YOU SOME KIND OF IDIOT???????
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