Garage door torsion spring relocation project (Status = Not going well)

[Danny D.]

Fair enough.

[Danny D.]

Fair enough.

[Danny D.]

Dan Musick at DDM Garage doors, who was the first to tell me that my side bearing plates were moving - is the one who suggested shoring it up with the angle irons he sent me.

He knows doors, doesn't he?

[DD_BobK]

Oren-

I have a strong suspicion that Danny D. is "arkland"... the fool who turned a 50+ year old oak into a pile of logs to large to split just to satisfy his desire to "improve the view".

Now he is attempting to "repair" a faulty torsion spring installation but is afraid (?) to remove some drywall to really see what's going on. He thinks added angle iron or a steel sheet will do something to help. Because he is view obsessed (ugly, ugly, ugly comment) be prefers to add material rather than remove it, do the job right & replace / repair the finish.

Thank goodness he's an accountant & not a contractor, engineer or surgeon.

But....OTOH he did work through that backflow preventer restoration (albeit, slowly, painfully & ineptly).

He definitely gets some points for persistence but I'm not sure he's smart enough to learn. Stupid is really hard to fix.

OP (Danny D or arkland?)

Wise up....start listening to the guys in AHR who are generous enough to give you the benefit of their knowledge & experience. After your oak tree performance followed by this garage door thing...I'm convinced you're probably not worth the time.

cheers Bob

[DD_BobK]

Simple.... your true personality shines through. Stupidity of your caliber is nearly impossible to mask.

Why not drop the attempt at anonymity, wise up & follow the sage advice you're being given?

cheers Bob

ps how's the pile of oak doing?

[DD_BobK]

Hey Danny..... hear the sound of a competent guy who's tried to help you getting frustrated & getting ready to give up on you? The rest there or getting close. You're wasting people's time.

Dan Musick at DDM Garage doors is going from what you told him & his general experience.... he knows WAY less about your specific installation than the readers of this thread.

Do us all a huge favor ....quit it with the name changes, your bad behavior is affecting all the other novices that pass through.

[dpb]

Hell if I know; don't know the man.

Angle would be fine as a cross member to mount to but you've still got to find something to mount them to and get access to whatever it is that is solid to be able to do so.

Neither of which you can do w/o being able to see what you got where.

Certainly just attaching them to the sheetrock or some other flimsy blocking internally won't make any difference for more than a short time at best, anyway.

[dpb]

...

He's inside the wall and can't get out... :)

--

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done: No need to respond. I just want to close the loop as a courtesy to all that helped, and, also in case someone with similar problems wishes to learn the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Thanks for your help. I'm not sure why anonymity gets folks so angry - but - I've been on the net for decades, and have learned looooong ago not to sling mud. I thank you all for your advice - and I hope you realize I was responsive (until people got nasty) - and that I answered all your queries for more information - and I followed all the advice EXCEPT the ripping out of the walls.

In the end, it's clear as night and day the garage is NOT a wood-framed structure - and that the original garage door installers had the same problem that I did and they simply left the top foot of EVERY door unbolted.

I've rectified that. It's not pretty. It's not even fully functional - but it is MUCH BETTER than it was before!

For that, I thank you all!

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done: No need to respond. I just want to close the loop as a courtesy to all that helped, and, also in case someone with similar problems wishes to learn the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Thanks for your help. I'm not sure why anonymity gets folks so angry - but - I've been on the net for decades, and have learned looooong ago not to sling mud. I thank you all for your advice - and I hope you realize I was responsive (until people got nasty) - and that I answered all your queries for more information - and I followed all the advice EXCEPT the ripping out of the walls.

In the end, it's clear as night and day the garage is NOT a wood-framed structure - and that the original garage door installers had the same problem that I did and they simply left the top foot of EVERY door unbolted.

I've rectified that. It's not pretty. It's not even fully functional - but it is MUCH BETTER than it was before!

For that, I thank you all!

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done: No need to respond. I just want to close the loop as a courtesy to all that helped, and, also in case someone with similar problems wishes to learn the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Thanks for your help. I'm not sure why anonymity gets folks so angry - but - I've been on the net for decades, and have learned looooong ago not to sling mud. I thank you all for your advice - and I hope you realize I was responsive (until people got nasty) - and that I answered all your queries for more information - and I followed all the advice EXCEPT the ripping out of the walls.

In the end, it's clear as night and day the garage is NOT a wood-framed structure - and that the original garage door installers had the same problem that I did and they simply left the top foot of EVERY door unbolted.

I've rectified that. It's not pretty. It's not even fully functional - but it is MUCH BETTER than it was before!

For that, I thank you all!

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done:

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done:

[Danny D.]

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done:

[Danny D.]

Ooops. Sorry for the repost. The post didn't go through so I hit the resend, but, apparently it 'did' go through. Please ignore the repost.

[Danny D.]

Yikes. Sorry about all the posts. I had just recently added Tor, Privoxy, Vidalia, and Polipo and it seems to be affecting the NNTP news. Since I haven't posted in a while, I hadn't noticed the nntp user agent hasn't properly been torified.

Sorry about the duplictes. Please ignore.

[DanG]

Cut a piece of 3/4" plywood that is wide enough for the thing(s) you want to attach. Cut it full height of the wall face so you can fasten it to the double plate at the ceiling and the 2x that is pinned to the bottom of the I beam.

[jloomis]

I read through and saw many pictures. I was not able to give a good answer other than making sure the center bearing and end plates do not move. They do need to be fastened to solid blocking with good anchoring lags. I always drill a size of the shank and let the threads eat into the wood. I did a test and found that a lag just screwed into wood could pull out easier than if it was pre-drilled with a shank size bit that allowed thread bite. In some cases I have spanned over "un-blocked" areas with flat sheet metal to "catch " solid blocking. Then I attach the bracket to the sheet metal. Also the long shaft of garage doors is somewhat flexible. It will move up and down regardless of the tightness of the anchoring plates. Undoing and redoing those springs is tough. Counting the right turns and going in the correct direction for winding is critical too. On some doors you have a left and right wind. Also lubrication of wheels and bearings makes a garage door last longer and run smoother. john

FINAL UPDATE (as a good net citizen).

I noticed you guys were unhappy so I simply stopped asking questions and just finished the job by immobilizing the bearing end plates and relocating & then securing the spring anchor plate.

I had to take down the tracks to get enough room to work and leveled them and bolted them back together when I was done.

It turns out the other garage door has the exact same construction as there is absolutely no wood above the doorway that is substantial.

There is no doubt of this now. It's clearly a steel-supported structure - where the wood is only bolted to the steel for the overhead storage area and nowhere else.

Only if you're interested, here are the final results.

1. Final view (ugly, Rube Goldberged, but relatively functional): Closeup of the right bearing end plate support: Closeup of the spring anchor plate new bearing from Dan: Closeup of the spring anchor plate from below: Closeup of the left bearing end plate support (for two doors): A view of the newly relocated and reinstalled spring: Looking up at the right bearing end plate new support: Then spring anchor plate still bends - not much can be done: No need to respond. I just want to close the loop as a courtesy to all that helped, and, also in case someone with similar problems wishes to learn the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Thanks for your help. I'm not sure why anonymity gets folks so angry - but - I've been on the net for decades, and have learned looooong ago not to sling mud. I thank you all for your advice - and I hope you realize I was responsive (until people got nasty) - and that I answered all your queries for more information - and I followed all the advice EXCEPT the ripping out of the walls.

In the end, it's clear as night and day the garage is NOT a wood-framed structure - and that the original garage door installers had the same problem that I did and they simply left the top foot of EVERY door unbolted.

I've rectified that. It's not pretty. It's not even fully functional - but it is MUCH BETTER than it was before!

For that, I thank you all!

[PeterD]

This little fact has been proven by others as well... Always best to pre-drill the proper sized hole!

[Danny D.]

Effectively, that's what I did since there were absolutely no substantial studs anywhere near the garage door track upper ends.

Only I used a metal plate instead of the plywood.

The hardest part was measuring accurately because the ceiling sloped and the bearing end plate flag supports had been previously bent inward.