Furnace cycling

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Take the pleated filter out and replace with the kind you used to have and see if the problem goes away.
Steve B.
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Hi Steve, hope you are having a nice day
On 13-Mar-05 At About 11:14:06, Steve B. wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
SB> > You know, I did just replaced the filter with one of those SB> pleated ones in >lieu of the cheap fiberglass one that was in there SB> about a week ago. > >Stone >
SB> Take the pleated filter out and replace with the kind you used to SB> have and see if the problem goes away.
Judging by his description this will not fix the problem.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. "Things don't bug you if you don't think about them." -- Calvin
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wrote:

If the system is cycling on high limit it is possibly an airflow problem. If the HO were to remove the filter and it works normally, the problem may not be solved but it would be identified, no?
Joseph

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Hi Gary, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 01:27:53, Gary Stone wrote to Gary Stone Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
GS>
GS>> Hi, I've got a forced air propane furnace, Luxaire model GSU082MF GS>> Series NAGOE (could be a Q) serial #1310002 Controlled by a Honeywell GS>> T87F heat only thermostat. This morning I was down in the basement GS>> and noticed that it had the initial ignition then that cut off after GS>> a while (normal burn) then a couple of minutes later a second GS>> ignition which ran a couple of minutes, when that cut off I headed GS>> up the stairs only to hear it kick in a third time for a couple GS>> of minutes. Total time for this was about 10 to 13 minutes. Before GS>> I went down there I had moved the thermostat only to the point which GS>> it kicked in, 60 F from 58 F so, it wasn't that drastic a jump. GS>> Yeah, I like it on the cool side. The outside temp was 19 F. I do GS>> not remember it ever acting in this manner and suspect there might GS>> be a problem, Yes? No? Thanks for any input.
GS>> Stone
>> have you moved or made any adjustments to the thermostat? if not it >> could be a sign of unit failure coming. Do you have normal >> maintenance done? if not it may be time to have it cleaned and tuned.
>> -=> HvacTech2 <=-
GS> Had it cleaned about this time last year and he did adjust the GS> thermostat, I don't know what he did there but he did say the furnace GS> was in good shape and that he set the thermostat to a 1 something GS> or other, mean anything to you? I did try to move the HA setting GS> on Sctooz advise from 5 to 6 but moved it back to 5 as the burner GS> kicked in 4 times at 6. Well, I turned the stat down, didn't want GS> to try for a 5th. I know it's wasting propane but is it presenting GS> a fire hazard? When you say "Unit Failure" do you mean the GS> thermostat or the furnace?
I can't check it for sure since I am not there but it sounds like the unit needs to be checked and cleaned. the thermostat is probably fine.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. "I'm moving to Mars next week, so if you have any boxes..."- s.w.
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I did call the local HVAC guy here in town but had to leave a message. Hasn't called back, could be out of town. In the mean time I've got the wood burning stove going. Nice to have that to fall back on. Funny how these things always seem to happen on a Friday or Saturday. Thanks for the help.
Stone
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wrote:

yes, it could make it cycle worse. i did not say it would fix it. his prob could very well be any number of furnace part related probs.
this was just a suggestion for a easy check he could do himself. all the heat anticipator setting is for is to match the amp draw thro the thermostat for correct furnace cycles. most run around 4 or 6 on the settings.
for some strange reason, the pointer seems to get moved occasionally. ive adjusted quite a few of them and that turned out to be the only problem. as for burning it out just by changing the setting, its not very likely. usually the only thing that will burn it out is a low voltage short from the furnace controls or a high voltage related surge thro the thermostat wire.
at any rate, the best thing to do is to call a reputable serv comp and let a tech take a look at it.
---------------------------------------------------
Scootz
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Hi Scootz, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 11:18:23, Scootz wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
S> yes, it could make it cycle worse. i did not say it would fix it. his S> prob could very well be any number of furnace part related probs.
S> this was just a suggestion for a easy check he could do himself. all S> the heat anticipator setting is for is to match the amp draw thro S> the thermostat for correct
This part is correct.
S> furnace cycles. most run around 4 or 6 on S> the settings.
This part is not correct. the setting should match the actual amp draw. not "around" a setting.
S> for some strange reason, the pointer seems to get moved occasionally.
They do not "move" themselves. someone has to do it physically.
S> ive adjusted quite a few of them and that turned out to be the only S> problem. as for burning it out just by changing the setting, S> its not very likely.
it will burn out if you go too low on the setting.
S> usually the only thing that will burn it out S> is a low voltage short from the furnace controls or a high voltage S> related surge thro the thermostat wire.
see above.
S> at any rate, the best thing to do is to call a reputable serv comp S> and let a tech take a look at it.
Another true statement.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. Setting his death ray blaster on frappe, our hero sets off looking ...
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Thanks Scootz, waiting for the heating contractor to call me back. Probably won't here from him till Monday though.
Stone

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wrote:

apples and oranges dood. he asked for a few things he might be able to check, simply. you know as well as i do that the average homeowner isnt going to have an amp probe or the knowledge to use it. it was something he could check without damaging anything or hurting himself.
yes, it should match the amp draw. do you test the amp draw on every thermostat that you lay your hands on every day? not likely. nor was it checked when the stat was installed either. most are not. usually the tech who puts it on sets it "around" 6 for carrier or 4 for older ruud or rheem equipment, as a loose general example.

no, they dont "move" themselves. maybe he pulled the cover off and wiped the dust off of it. they do get moved sometimes. it was a suggestion only. nitpick it some more, i can tell now you can't seem to let this go.

maybe so, but i didnt tell him to turn it all the way down now did i?

at least we agree on something

you know, this is why ive never posted in here, nor do i post in althvac.
<yea, i lurk and read both of these grps, so i know your nym>
he asked a simple question and got a simple answer.
---------------------------------------------------
Scootz
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What kind of filter do you have? The home centers are selling lots of pleated filters like the 3M Filtrete. These filters have more pressure drop and resistance to air flow than a fiberglass filter dirty enough to grow seedlings in it. you could have a problem with low airflow tripping the high limit switch. Put in a clean fiberglass filter and try again. Messing with the heat anticipator is for professionals that can measure the results. Make sure the registers in all rooms are open. People sometiumes close them "to save money" and reduce airflow in the system. Low airflow can ruin equipment.
stretch
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How much of a pressure drop is that. How much would that extra resistance raise the TD?
--
Bob Pietrangelo
snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net
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I tested air filters at my family's old company. I used 20 x 20 x 1 filters in a test stand. I used 800 CFM as a standart air flow, using a flow hood to measure air flow and a damper to control it. A standard fiberglass filter had a pressure drop of 0.75 to 0,8 inches water column (IWC) at 800 CFM. all the 1" thick pleated filters that I tested had a pressure drop of 0.2 Inches Water Column. That is 2-1/2 times as much as a standard fiberglass filter! After being used in our HVAC system for three months as recommended by the filter manufacturer, the pressure drop on one of them was 0.35 IWC! I wrote an article about my experience and it was published in the October 1999 issue of Contracting Business Magazine. I can email you a copy of the article if you can send me a copy of your email address that I can read.
Stretch 843-385-2220 O'Neill Bagwell Cooling & Heating sixfoot7 @ sccoast . net
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Hi stretch, 3m pleated, right after I replied to HvacTech2 I read your post and figured what the heck. Went down the basement and got the old fiberglass filter and tapped out the loose gunk, put it back in and turned up the stat. Sat there and watched it. The burner did cycle on a second time but then I remembered the vent on the side of the cold air return at the furnace had been closed off when some work was done on the house cause of code, but the guy left it so it could be opened and said if you ever have trouble you can open it. About 3 seconds after I opened it the burner shut off and there was not a third or fourth burn. Right now it is hotter than hell in here and the wood stove is going. Will try it in morning and see if it's back to 1 burn. Going to have the Tech out anyway to check things out for safety's sake.
Stone
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Hi Gary, hope you are having a nice day
On 13-Mar-05 At About 15:03:52, Gary Stone wrote to Gary Stone Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
GS> it. About 3 seconds after I opened it the burner shut off and there GS> was not a third or fourth burn. Right now it is hotter than hell GS> in here and the wood stove is going. Will try it in morning and see GS> if it's back to 1 burn. Going to have the Tech out anyway to check GS> things out for safety's sake.
Please let me know the results.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. Let him who is stoned cast the first sin.
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Hi, This morning it is back to a single burn.
Stone
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Hi Gary, hope you are having a nice day
On 13-Mar-05 At About 22:46:14, Gary Stone wrote to Gary Stone Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
GS>
GS>> it. About 3 seconds after I opened it the burner shut off and there GS>> was not a third or fourth burn. Right now it is hotter than hell GS>> in here and the wood stove is going. Will try it in morning and see GS>> if it's back to 1 burn. Going to have the Tech out anyway to check GS>> things out for safety's sake.
>> Please let me know the results.
>> -=> HvacTech2 <=-
GS> Hi, This morning it is back to a single burn.
GS> Stone
Good. thank you for getting back with the results.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. Let him who is stoned cast the first sin.
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I want to thank you and everyone else for the help. Truly appreciate it.
Stone
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I just reread the OP's posts and it seems clear to me that it is up and burning and the fan is running when it kicks out repeatedly with out cycling the fan. I may be miss-interpreting it though...
Joseph

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OP here, Fan runs normally, burner is cycling on and off. Anyway, have to call the guy back tomorrow, will let you know what it ends up being.
Stone
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Hi Joseph, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 21:08:42, Joseph wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
J> >> wrote:
>> SB> > You know, I did just replaced the filter with one of those SB>> pleated ones in >lieu of the cheap fiberglass one that was in there >> SB> about a week ago. > >Stone >
SB>> Take the pleated filter out and replace with the kind you used to SB>> have and see if the problem goes away.
>> Judging by his description this will not fix the problem.
J> If the system is cycling on high limit it is possibly an airflow J> problem. If the HO were to remove the filter and it works normally, J> the problem may not be solved but it would be identified, no?
if you read the original. by what he describes the burner doesn't run long enough for the fan to even come on.
-=> HvacTech2 <=-
.. Live long enough to become a problem to your kids.
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