EPA caught VW cheating - how does the car know it's being tested?

[micky]

Many corporations have no morals these days, and like most criminals, they think they won't get caught. Do you remember Bank of America, how when it got several checks whose total exceeded the money in someone's checking account, regardelss of the order they came in, they would process the biggest ones first, so as to empty the checking account so that all the little checks bounced, giving them as much insufficient funds fees as possible. That was outright stealing by the Bank of America. They only changed because the government caught them and made them.

I had occasion to be in a Wells Fargo branch, and I was telling the bank officer why I despised Bank of America and he was telling me I should change to Wells Fargo, and 6 months later, 2 or 3 years afer the incident with Bank of Am. and I reed in the paper that Wells Fargo is doing the same thing, and they didn't even stop after Bank of Am got caught. They are also thieves and if they don't steal more often, it's because they think they'll get caught, not because those in charge have any morals.

[micky]

Only with half of what you say. They will do t he same on the emissions test, and continue to pass unless something is broken.

But yes, that means they'll get lower mileage, not just during the test.

VW should pay them for the extra gas they will have to buy, and pay them for the time it takes to go to the gas station and get it.

[micky]

Maryland used OBD on cars new enough. That includes my 2000 car, but I don't think included my 1995 car.

(For the 1995 it used the dynamometer and tailpipe stick) I think when I turn 70, if I don't drive too much, I won't have to be tested. Or my car.

[Cursitor Doom]

Sorry, I should have mentioned that the position I set out is that under English law and other jurisdictions will no doubt differ.

[sms]

You said it yourself. You can't pass emissions with pending codes. They have to run a scan to check this. That's why before they even stick the exhaust gas analyzer into the tail pipe they read the codes. No point proceeding with the test if there are unset codes, though if you're paying for the test they will complete it to check for other failure modes as well.

At least that's the procedure for the four vehicles I have had smogged every two years for the past 20 or so years. Also the procedure at the repair shop my relative operated until he sold it last month, and he probably did 3000 or so smog checks per year.

I guess you could claim that it is not a requirement to run a scan, it's just a requirement that you can't pass with pending codes and the only way to check for pending codes is to do a scan. If there is another way to check for pending codes other than doing a scan you would be correct, but I don't think that there is.

[sms]

How did they check for pending codes if they did not use a code scanner? You can't pass with more than two pending codes (one on some years).

That shop would be shut down by the state if it was found that they were passing cars without checking for pending codes.

[sms]

That was the big problem in California. A significant number of out-of-compliance vehicles were causing most of the pollution. Even though percentage-wise the number of such vehicles was small, in absolute numbers it was large enough to cause a problem.

The "catalytic converter test pipe" was popular for a while. But as you said, in most cases, all the tampering with emissions controls did not have any effect on mileage and/or power.

[trader_4]

NJ has exactly the same plan. Five years for new cars, two years after that.

[trader_4]

"Many instances" in a country of 320 mil people and God knows how many cars doesn't impress me. I say it's still an insignificant percentage of the cars out there. All the people I know, not a single one has done it. And if they can do it and are that determined, they can surely undo it once every two years to get the car through the inspection that is being advocated to prevent it.

I'd like to see the proof for that. Changes in car/engine design over decades has greatly reduced emissions. I've never seen anything that shows that inspections made any significant or more importantly, cost effective reduction.

[trader_4]

It's especially silly given that people in those groups, that are that determined, can surely undo what they did to get the car through a test every two years. And like you say, they are such a tiny fraction of the cars out there, it's like worrying about a fart in a hurricane.

[trader_4]

Show us some case examples. IF true, must be one screwed up legal system, where if you don't change your oil or filter on schedule, it has bearing on who's at fault in an accident.

[Scott Dorsey]

They look for the light on the dashboard that indicates codes have been logged.

In some places they always use the scanner to make sure, for instance, that the ECU wasn't reset immdiately before taking the car in for inspection. In some places they do not.

--scott

[Malcom Mal Reynolds]

but otherwise it's okay?

[clare]

Which can only make the situation MUCH worse.

[clare]

Why people would not remove the "bypoass boxes" to return the vehicle to stock before submitting for E-Test is beyond me - - - . Same with "power tuners". They have the capability of storing more than one tune

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[clare]

Officially, all cars 1996 and newer must be OBD2 compliant, but most jurisdictions using OBD2 for E-Testing only start at 1997 models because some 1996 models were not fully compliant. Only a very few

1995 vehicles had OBD2 capability as 1995 was "pre-standard"

[clare]

In ontario the testers are directly connected to a central computer and it is virtually impossible to go from stem 1 to step 3 without completing step 2 first.

A number of years back, some crooks were running a "good" vehicle through the test 5 or 6 times, entering the Vin for one that would not pass. They made changes to the system that prevented that pretty quick.

[clare]

Didn't have any significant positive effect on mileage and or power.

And the "test pipe" stopped being an option in 1996 with OBD2 testing pre and post cat O2 - unless you bought an O2 fake-out device that generated a fake O2 signal (actually, 2 signals ----)- which caused other problems (genrally a lot poorer fuel mileage and not much power improvement, if any)

[clare]

Except "pending"codes don't turn on the CEL, and the CEL does not indicate if monitors have been "set"

[Ewald B?hm]

That.