Downsizing a hole in drywall

[Not]

We have (had, I guess) a glass shelf in our bathroom, with glass holders mounted to anchors in the drywall. One came loose, and eventually the hole in the drywall became to large to set the anchor.

Because of the unique glass holders, I cannot use a larger anchor, nor will toggles work with the screw I have to use. Relocating the hole would be problematic. So now I want to patch the drywall and restore the quarter inch hole.

My plan is to use mesh on the back of the drywall, fill the oversize hole with plaster, then redrill. I've had good results using this technique for patching, but I'm a bit concerned that the new hole I drill will be almost as big as the oversized hole, and the anchor may not hold. Years ago, I think I heard that wood glue can be mixed with plaster to form a stronger surface, but my bottle of wood glue says nothing about this.

So my question is whether mixing wood glue with the plaster will give a stronger repair and, if so, about what portion of wood glue to plaster is appropriate.

I'm unhappy, because a few years ago we had two hardware stores near us, either of which would have provided good advice, but Home Depot has driven them out of business.

[dadiOH]

I've never mixed wood glue *with* plaster but I *have* applied it to plaster after it cured...let it soak in, wipe off excess. In your case I'd squirt cyanoacrylate glue into the sides of the hole in the new plaster. As absorbent as plaster is, the super glue will wick through the new plaster into the old and make a hole solid as Gibralter.

[Ken]

Why don't you take a piece of wood capable of being inserted into the hole (or a larger hole) with a string attached to the center of the wood. For instance if the hole is one inch, the wood could be 1/2 inch stock measuring 1 x 6 inches. Drill a hole in the center of the wood and knot the string so that it can prevent the wood from falling once inserted into the wall. Before inserting into the wall, apply some mastic or thick glue to the side that will contact the sheet rock. When inserted into the wall, pull on the string so that the glue on the wood contacts the sheet rock. Let the glue dry, cut the string, fill the hole in the dry wall with patching plaster, and drill a new hole so the screw holding the glass holder is secured by the wood rather than the sheet rock.

[Edwin Pawlowski]

How did Home Depot put them out of business?

Did they block the entrance so customers could not get in? No Did they sue the owners and force them out? No Did the bribe town officials to condemn the store? No. Did they have the utilities cut and leave them in the dark? No

People just like you and I put them out of business. We stopped going there. We had a choice and we decided it was more important to save a few pennies than to go to the local store for our needs. We decided that HD had a better selection so we went there instead of the local store.

We complain that things cost too much so stores like Home Depot find cheaper sources in places like China and we buy them. Then we are happy with the price, but complain because we lost our manufacturing jobs to other countries. Instead of spending the weekend at home enjoying friends and family, we go to the mall and buy cheap stuff from overseas.

Pogo said: "we have met the enemy and it is us". That was over 45 years ago and still true today.

[tnom]

Take a popsicle stick or two and coat one side with rubber cement. do the same with the inside of the wall. Let the cement dry long enough to be tacky. Spear the middle of the popsicle stick with a large safety pin. Insert the stick into the wall and shim the 90 degree bend of the pin to hold it in place. Fill the hole when the cement is dry

[<aemeijers]

Since you are gonna be mudding and painting anyway- a &#39;forever&#39; repair would be to run a piece of wood between the studs, flushed into the drywall. Mud it in, sand smooth, and paint to match. If the wood is screwed to the studs, and the shelf brackets to the wood, the glass will break before the mount points ever do. This isn&#39;t a new trick- this is the best way to hang wall-mount sinks.

aem sends...

[Jeff Wisnia]

Bravo! Very well said.

An excellent example of what happens when people confuse want with need and try and get the maximum possible amount of goods for whatever amount of income they have to spend.

(The same kind of people usually don&#39;t put anything away "for a rainy day" and end up in a fiscal crisis if something stops their income for even one paycheck.)

Jeff

[Al Bundy]

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in news:Ld1Jg.2162$aQ4.1459@trndny06:

Well said facts Edwin.

Back in VT there was a hardware store that one day began a "closing the doors" clearance. Had been there a long time. HD moved in like 6-12 mos before. Was talking to they owner who I knew personnally. Basically said the same as you just did. One comment that stuck was that when people want a few loose nuts/bolts/washers they come by hoping to only have to spend a nickel or two and not have to drive 5mi. When they need a hedge trimmer they run to HD and Wally World.

[Bob]

If you can get mesh in there, how about glueing a chunk of wood across the back of the hole. Then you will have something to screw to. Fixall might make a pretty strong patch. It&#39;s pretty hard stuff when cured.

Bob

[lwasserm]

Instead of just mesh at the back of the hole, use a small piece of wood. Make the hole large enough so that a small piece of wood can be passed through it. Support the wood with DW screws through sound drywall a couple/few inches from the hole. Then fill the hole. You can then drive your mounting screws into the wood also.

I&#39;ll try to draw here:

| Pass piece of wood through hole: | _____

[jeffc]

As others have mentioned, put a piece of wood back there and drill into that. Otherwise, you should take out a larger section of drywall (say at least 6x6") and repair that. Then you will be anchoring to a solid piece of drywall, not some rigged up piece of highly questionable integrity.

[Phisherman]

I agree with using a 2x4 between the studs. I installed tub/shower safety grab bars and cut openings from the other side to install 2x4 wood brackets. From the bathroom I was able to drive screws into the brackets. I&#39;m confident the grab bars will hold 300+ lbs. When I removed the piece of drywall I did so carefully using a utility knife so I could use it to screw back in place. I cut the drywall edges centered on the studs to make the drywall repair easy.

[Keith Williams]

Which store? The ACE (I think it was) in EJ never did have anything to sell. They had no stock *years* before HomeDespot knew VT existed. Several others were the same. Good riddance! OTOH, there is a decent HW store on the other side of Burlington that&#39;s expanded and a new ACE in S. Burlington opened about 1Mi. from the HomeDespot.

No, some stores have no idea how to compete. They don&#39;t *DESERVE* my patronage (come on Lowes!).

[Edwin Pawlowski]

Ace and True Value stores have access to more stuff than you can imagine. If they choose not to stock it, shame on them. The put themselves out of business.

[Keith Williams]

Exactly. There were a few really good HW stores in the Poughkeepsie NY area when I lived there. HD came in in the mid &#39;90s. The good HW stores are still there and thriving. They had exceptional inventory and service. Since they did a lot of contractor volume their pricing wasn&#39;t all that bad either.

OTOH, the marginal stores had crap selection, no service to speak of, and did such measly volume their prices were outta sight. In short, they had nothing *to* sell. I don&#39;t owe a store my business just because the owner may be a local.

[Nick Danger]

I posted this to another thread a few weeks ago. It never made it to my news server. If it made it to yours and you read it, I apologize for repeating it.

Let&#39;s take a moment to remember how HD was able to get so big so fast. Go back in time ~20 years. You need a special fitting to fasten some piece of your house to some other piece of your house. You go to your local hardware store and head for the counter to talk to the guy who dispenses this stuff. There&#39;s no discernible line anywhere at the counter, but it&#39;s surrounded by the guy&#39;s contractor buddies, who are milling around, smoking cigarettes, and telling dirty jokes among themselves and occasionally transacting some business. The guy at the counter ignores you for as long as he can, but eventually you make a determined effort to make eye contact with him, so he decides everyone would be more comfortable if he gets you out of there.

Counter guy: What do you want? You: Umm. I need a connector for a frammitz device. It&#39;s made by Acme inc. The label says it&#39;s part number ncc-1701. Counter guy: Is that an inside fitting or an outside fitting? You: Huh? How can I tell? (Contractor buddies all laugh.) Counter guy: Here&#39;s the pictures. Which one is it? You: Well, it doesn&#39;t look like either of these. It&#39;s green, and kind of squarish. (Contractor buddies all laugh.) Counter guy: Must be an outside fitting. They haven&#39;t made inside fittings in 30 years. Is it type 31A or ddb lzmdc ouaejk? You: Well... I just know the part number. Counter guy: Listen kid, when you know what you want, come back and we&#39;ll be able to help you. (Counter guy and contractor buddies resume what they were doing.)

Consider also what happened when you needed lumber. This time, somehow you are prepared and know what you want. You negotiate the deal at the counter and guy tells you to bring your truck out to the yard. You know right away you&#39;re going to get laughed at when you show up with a car. The yard man shows up 20 minutes after you pull in. He goes way back in the yard and comes back with the wood. Of course, he selects the pieces and they are all warped and cracked. If you complain, he sneers that that&#39;s all they have and you can take it or leave it. Now you have to decide whether to face the counter guy again (and get the same treatment when you try to buy at a different hardware store) or just settle for what he gives you.

Meanwhile, the Home Depot opened up at the other end of town. The contracting business was kind of slow (that&#39;s why all those contractors had time to hang out at the counter at the hardware store). Home Depot offered jobs to these contractors. They didn&#39;t pay all that well, but it was steady work, indoors, with benefits. All they had to do was be courteous and helpful with the customers. If you weren&#39;t sure what you wanted, the clerk would listen to your whole story, tell you what you needed to know to make sure you got the right part, and probably give you loads of advice on the best way to do the job. It didn&#39;t take long for the homeowners to decide to take their business to Home Depot.

Over the years, Home Depot became big and prosperous, and the stockholders demanded that they squeeze out more profits, so they had to cut back on expenses, meaning buying cheaper goods and paying the help less. The contracting business picked up, and all the contractors they had hired (the good ones anyway) went back to contracting. The only help left were the losers or the oldtimers and idealists who were still clinging in vain to the dream of a place where customers and staff interacted in harmony. Some of the neighborhood hardware stores eventually got their act together, but performance was inconsistent, so most homeowners just accepted what they got at HD, since by this time, they were conditioned to the Big Box store shopping experience.

[frank megaweege]

There&#39;s an Ace hardware and an independent lumber yard in town that provide much better service than Lowe&#39;s or HD, that is, when they&#39;re open (not after 6 on weekdays or 2 on saturday or ever on sunday), which is the biggest impediment to doing business with them for a diy homeowner with a full time job. Still, I try. In a twist to your points above I think the box stores are becoming more hostile to diy&#39;ers and catering more to contractors. Lately I&#39;ve been encountering a condescending attitude from Lowe&#39;s staff especially. That is if you can actually corner someone who will make eye contact.

[dadiOH]

You went to different hardware/lumber stores than I did. The little hardware stores had a wonderful array of esoteric stuff. True, there was little call for many of the items but they carried them anyway. Big, local hardware stores were a bit of a rarity but I was fortunate to live in Honolulu and Kilgo&#39;s was available...they too have tons of stuff and a staff that knows where they are and what they are for.

All the lumber places I went to would let me do my own picking. A

*long* time ago, you could pick and they would then mill to your specs and load you up. That still exists some places (Mexico for one) but probably not in the US.

There used to be a couple of fairly good lumber places near me where I currently live (central Florida) but they are now "contractor only". Nearest place I could buy now is 45 minutes away. Even though I can&#39;t pick my own, it is easier to buy from NC and have it shipped to me by truck. Lowes/HD don&#39;t have any worthwhile lumber...even their 2x4 studs would have been laughed out of town not too many years ago.

Seems to me that one of the biggest problems is the same as with hamburgers...there are a couple of generations of people who have never known a good one so they can&#39;t tell good from bad.

[Al Bundy]

Keith Williams wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Yea, Gabby&#39;s in the junction. I tend to agree with you on stock. But I was not thrilled when Flander&#39;s closed.

[Keith Williams]

Flanders got pretty bad in its last years too. They didn&#39;t have all sizes of dimensional PT and left what they had laying in the mud. They also copped an attitude with DIYers. I ended up going there only for molding and such.