Do you think splicing 100' of wire onto a GTO exit wand would work?

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I bought too short of a driveway-gate exit wand (GTO FM139 = 50 feet); I need 150 feet.
Nobody told me (so I'm saying it here), one really needs about 150 feet if they want the driveway gate to be open by the time the moving mass of metal (i.e., automobile) reaches the gate. Lesson learned.
Researching the web, it appears GTO sells three wands: http://www.gtopro.com/access_controls.htm - FM139 = 50 feet wired (about $180) - FM140 = 100 feet wired (about $200) - FM141 = 150 feet wired (about $225)
The instructions say you can not splice additional lengths (http://www.gtopro.com/PDF/Flyers/Gate-Opener-Access-Control-FM139-vehicle-sensor.pdf )
Calling www.gtopro.com technical support at 800-543-4283, they say there is no difference between the wands or the wire other than the length BUT if I splice in a wire, it won't work.
The technical support guy was very helpful. He said the reason it won't work is that the "sensitivity of the magnetic field" changes with the splice.
I don't understand why (if I make a good splice) but maybe there is something about magnetic fields I don't understand that you can elucidate for me? The wire is 5 conductor 16awg multi-strand shielded.
What is it about a splice that destroys the magnetic field?
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One thing is shielding of the splice... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage
Then other than that, the wire length might have a certain *total* resistance or *total* capacitance and this is adjusted for at the wand or at the adjustment for the wand.
This principal might be along the lines of adjusting a CB antenna like it says here (length of the antenna matters)... http://www.wearecb.com/support/setcbantenna.htm
"Elmo" wrote in message

(http://www.gtopro.com/PDF/Flyers/Gate-Opener-Access-Control-FM139-vehicle-sensor.pdf
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On the face of it, this is a pile of manure.
It's possible (as someone else said) that the system might be calibrated for specific cable lengths, and it might be difficult to splice the wire in such a way as to maintain the desired electrical characteristics. But an amateur antenna system has at least two "splices" in it -- one at the transmitter, the other at the antenna -- and it works fine.
If the folks running the company are "nice" people, they should take back the too-short cable -- even though it's been used -- and give you full credit towards a cable of the right length.
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First thing, how do you get IN ????
Second thing, try an additional 5-10 feet and see if there is something other than ??
Whats the connector look like ??
greg
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On 2/1/2010 12:53 PM, GregS wrote:

They didn't say they couldn't get any but that the gate didn't open fast enough for the speed they were driving. Obviously one solution might be to go a little slower.

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This is for exit only. I asked how do they get in, thinking any decent gate will have a remote control. Go through same procedure as to get in, push button. !!!! That RF is a usefull thing !!! Remote control !!! A magnetic sensor is usefull to prevent closing the gate and hitting car.
greg

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On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 19:47:16 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@zekfrivolous.com (GregS) wrote:

Could be like the gate at a corporate site I occasionally visit - for entry, you speak to a guard and show ID via a TV camera and the guard opens the gate. A device like the one in this thread is used to allow people to exit the gate.
John
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On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 20:16:20 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@jecarter.us wrote:

Yes. The "typical" gate setup is:
1a. Owner approaches gate and flips remote control to get in. 1b. Utility truck approaches gate and pushed their logged 4-digit combo on the digital keypad to get in (whether or not someone is home) 1c. Guest arrives and has to press the intercom button and can only be let in if someone inside the house provides them access. Guest then pushes a button on the keypad to open the gate.
2. In all cases above, the gate closes 25 seconds after it was opened.
3. In all cases above, when the owner/utility/guest leaves, the gate automatically opens for them via the exit want magnetic field disturbance sensor.
At least that's how my gate is set up. Some are set up to open via cellphone but mine isn't fancy.
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I am familiar with only one setup. A sewage plant. The opperator controls gate open or close, and the pickup prevents the gate from ramming into the vehicle.
You must have many guests and visitors to warrent this setup you have,
greg
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On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 16:33:19 GMT, GregS wrote:

I think it's the "typical" setup to have a way for guests to leave.
You have to note that I considered wiring a push-button (doorbell type) switch in the house to open the gate for guests to leave but I can't even see the gate from the house since it's about 500 feet down a hill to the gate - so that would be a safety problem.
I guess I should walk everyone to the gate but that seems like a lot to ask of me. But I think most people have the following bare minimums and common electronics.
BARE MINIMUM ELECTRONICS: - Keypad & remote open (with automatic close) - Stall force setting so nobody gets crushed
EXTREMELY COMMON ELECTRONICS: - Intercom for convenient entrance of guests - Exit wand for automatic open upon exit
SPECIALTY ELECTRONICS: - Telephone-operated gates (open/close from your cell phone) - Video feeds on the gates (so you can see who is at the gate)
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On 2/2/2010 1:30 PM, Elmo wrote:

Or maybe you simply tell your departing guests "slow down when near the gate and wait for it to open"?
I have been to a number of places where the gate works as I described.
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On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 16:33:19 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@zekfrivolous.com (GregS) wrote:

Mine is similar to the one you know. It is residential, but guests have to bring some sewage to get in.

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On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 19:47:16 GMT, GregS wrote:

Guests won't have a remote control nor will they have the keypad combination.
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On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 17:53:54 GMT, GregS wrote:

There is a keypad to get in, and a remote. Both work fine for the owner of the house, but not for guests. Guests enter via the outside-the-gate intercom keypad. But the gate closes 25 seconds after being opened. When guests leave, the exit wand triggers the gate to open.
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On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 17:53:54 GMT, GregS wrote:

There is no connector. Each of the four 16 AWG multi-stranded wires arrives from the factory stripped of about 1/4 inch at the ends and tinned solid.
We just screw those four wires plus the shield into connections on the gate opener motherboard.
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On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 05:56:54 +0000 (UTC), Elmo

The simple answer is just try it! What do you loose, a few minutes of time?
That said, just make sure your splice is absolutely waterproof. 3M makes underground splice kits that may work (used primarily for telco work).
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On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 08:39:31 -0500, PeterD wrote:

I have to find the 4-wire multi-stranded shielded cable first ... but I will try the splice kit at the same time if I can find that also.
This morning I called GTO technical support again at 800-543-1236 and spoke this time with a woman with a southern accent who told me a splice could be done, but she said the problem is that it will eventually break. And, since it will be underground, I won't know where it is and I'll be calling technical support who won't know that it was spliced while they troubleshoot.
When I asked "but CAN it be spliced?", she confirmed there is no difference in the wand itself between the longer lengths of wire as the sensitivity adjustments are done on the gate control board itself.
I'll look for that 3M waterproof splice kit. I think I'll need a low-voltage splice kit. According to this web site, the voltage is 8 to 32 VAC or 8 to 26 VDC with a miniscule current of 1.5ma. http://www.allsecurityequipment.com/proddetail.asp?prod=GTO-FM141
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Be sure to let us know how this turns out. You owe us.
More below.
On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 15:07:32 +0000 (UTC), Elmo

No, it won't. Not if it's soldered correctly. Have you soldered much? Do you know how to solder well, to clean the wire first -- I just scrape four sides of the wire with a fairly sharp knife --, use flux core solder designed for electrical work, and make it hot enough to not get a cold solder joint?

Of course you'll know where it is. It will be 50 feet from where you buried the wand. And about 100 feet from where the controller is. Note how far from the driveway you bury it and measure how far from thecontroller it is, and write it down and tape it to the controller box.

The next owner might well be in that situation. Make sure you leave clear documentation for him. The guy who sold me my house spent an hour teling me things about it.

As I thought in some other post of mine.

Anything that works for high voltages works for low voltages. I'm not sure what the advantage of the kit is. Certainly if I couldn't find the kit, I'd just wrap the self-fusing tape around the wire, going an inch or more past the splice, past the part where the original insulation is still intact.
My neighbor had some semi-skilled guys putting in a small fence and they cut my phone line. Of course they "took repsonsibilty" and they were winding the wires together and taping them with standard electric tape. I came out and stopped them, and soldered the connections and wrapped them in this self-fusing tape, and even when I had dial-up internet, I got very good connection speeds.
Later, someone told me I should let the phone company repair it and indeed they would do it for free, but the guy on the phone said all they do is use those gel-filled connectors and what I did was better. Nothing beats solder, and no tape beats Scotch 23.
Now, if you don't have an connector on the end of the wire, you could use heat-shrink tubing, but though it looks real nice, it doesn't have much tension when shrinking or afterwareds, and I think the scotch 23, silicone tape will do a much better job.

BTW, are you near powerlines? Most places aren't but a few are.
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On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 14:55:51 -0500, mm wrote:

I have a propane torch, a smaller butane torch with soldering tips, and the Weller soldering station. I'm not all that good (I always seem to melt the solder instead of heating the wires) but I'd consider myself ok with solder.

I could also look for an electrical connection type box (like the ones used with the water sprinklers) and that way it would be obvious to all, even any new owners.

I think I'll solder in a compatible wire after finding that scotch 23 in a local hardware store. My home depot didn't have it.

Yes There are overhead power lines. Why do you ask?
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On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 06:10:55 +0000 (UTC), Elmo

I like an electric soldering iron for soldering wires. It's not like soldering metal gutters. :)

After 40 years I often melt the solder directly, but if you make sure it's hot before taking away the soldering iron, it's fine.

I wouldn't bother.

http://www.rshughes.com/products/054007_13061.html?ref=g&refcp=froogle
Some other websites had 50 or 100 roll minimums!

The docs mentioned power lines. but if they are overhead they are probably too far away to matter.
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