Dishwasher doesn't dry properly

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My DW, approx 2 years old, is a Whirlpool. Not high end. Invoice read: WH-WDFS1DPAYW, whatever the hell THAT means. (Bottom of invoice said don't rely on number!) If it helps, DW with tax & installation, was $608.
It has NEVER dried dishes properly; particularly cutlery in door basket is always wet.
When DW was installed, I studied the manual and set my preferences as follows:
NORMAL HIGH TEMP SANI-RINSE HEAT DRY.
I just re-consulted manual. It advises using rinse aid to get dishes dry. (I did that at first when using package of powdered detergent.)
But manual also advises using the little "pillows" or packets of detergent. I switched to packets from Costco long ago; box says packets *contain rinse aid.*
Whatthehell??!!
All I want is dry damn dishes & cutlery.
Any advice?
TIA
HB
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 2:59:08 PM UTC-4, Higgs Boson wrote:

my whirpool dishwasher is less than a year old, so far the main control panel faied and was replaced, then it quit drying dishes.....
the load i just removed was still wet. I just loaded the machine again but will call for more warranty service if they arent dry.....
frankly I think whirpool dishwashers are junk, I am going to stop at lowes tomorrow and talk with the store manager about having them replace the unit..
everyone is making everything so on the cheap its sad......
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 5:00:04 PM UTC-7, bob haller wrote:

[...]

my whirpool dishwasher is less than a year old, so far the main control panel faied and was replaced, then it quit drying dishes.....




YOU ARE SO RIGHT!
The dishwasher before this one was a KitchenAid. A tank! Ran for 13 years with never a sneeze. Then hot water wouldn't go in. I FOOLISHLY thought it would be too expensive to pay for repairs ??? so for the next 4 years I handwashed.
Then circumstances dictated that I get a new DW, so I had the old one taken out. Guess why hot water wasn't going in? A ****ing MOUSE had chewed holes in the ****ing hot water hose!!!! Easily replaced for small bux!!!
I am still banging my head against the wall for sacrificing that great old KitchenAid for this plastic POS. KA would have run forever; was well made!!! With 20-20 hindsight....!!!
HB
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On 5/26/2014 8:24 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:

Funny thing. We've always had KAs in our previous house. But, each one kept lasting fewer and fewer years. The 1st one lasted 23 years. The last one, actually the 3rd, less than 5 years. It would have cost more to fix it myself, than to replace it. KA actually gave me a $100 voucher to buy another KA. I did that and actually had to fix it a few times before we moved. Now it's someone else's problem. In my new house, now almost 5 years old, I have a WP, not top of the line. It is the best dishwasher we've ever had, as far as cleaning. The only major complaint is the silverware basket on the door. Because the new DWs have a larger capacity, the door hinge is mounted much lower to the floor, thus you almost have to sit on the floor to remove silverware. If I had realized this, I would have had the cabinet maker mount it higher, although you do loose some counter top space. I recommended this to my niece, as she was building after me, and now likes the raised DW. I realize that the basket is removable, with some difficulty, but in either case, it's not ideal. So, I tie wrapped the basket to the lower rack, and that seemed to fix some of the basket problems. I also have an old KA basket which I use on the top rack for smaller stuff. BTW, with the wonderful WP designed basket, you cannot put long items in the left side of the basket because they will prevent the soap door from opening! Nice going WP. As for drying, everything pretty much dries with the exception of plastic. I wonder if rinse agent will help that?
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 5:42:17 AM UTC-7, Art Todesco wrote:

Art, that's what I was asking at the outset! To repeat: WP manual says:
1. Little packets of detergent work best.
2. Use rinse agent.
BUT
3. Costco little packets say they *contain* rinse agent.
Who's on first?
Guess I'll just have to buy (expensive) bottles of rinse agent to see if it helps. But ISTR that wet cutlery problem dates from installation of new DW when I WAS using rinse agent. OK, launching experiment.
BTW, any chemistry folks around who know just whatthehell is in "rinse agent"???
HB
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On 5/27/2014 9:07 AM, Higgs Boson wrote:

HB, As for drying, my WP pretty much dries everything, with the exception of the plastic, including the inside of the door, which is plastic. Of course, anything with a dimple on the bottom, now on the top, will hold water ... but I don't think anything can solve that except for buying flat bottom cups and glasses. When we used to make our kids unload the dw (we're empty nesters now), they used to complain about the bottoms holding water. In some cases, they actually drilled drain holes in some of the plastic stuff, where it wouldn't compromise the container. I remember my daughter drilled small holes in the food processor bowl that would drain through the side. When the cycle finishes, we usually open the door and pull out the plastic stuff and leave the door open to evaporate water on the inside of the door and anything that got splashed when removing the plastic. We too, use the all in one detergent + rinse agent (a commercial brand). We're definitely going to try the liquid to see what happens with the plastic.
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 6:07:00 AM UTC-7, Higgs Boson wrote:

Thanks to all for opening door/evaporation option. Will try it & report.

[mucho snippage]

As for drying, everything pretty much dries with the exception of plastic. I wonder if rinse agent will help that?


TIA
HB
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 6:07:00 AM UTC-7, Higgs Boson wrote:

. As for drying, everything pretty much dries


Update: Ran a load WITH rinSe agent added to Costco packets. Dried much better; even cutlery. So Costco saying their product contains rinse agent...??
BTW, any chemistry folks around who know just whatthehell is in "rinse agent"???
Update: I went to several DIY sites which recommended plain white vinegar instead of rin$se agent. Might that be a clue to what's in the commercial product? Anybody ever try it? B
HB
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Higgs Boson wrote:

Hmm, When I bought Bosch DW not long ago, shop gave me sample pack of Bosch brand detergent cubes. I was told they are made from apple cider vinegar. I still have some left. I couldn't smell any vinegar from it. Usually we use Finish Platinum pillows. And Finish rinse agent. Machine turns little red light on when rinse agent tank is empty. It means using rinse agent is important? Old Whirl Pool worked fine without it. After I load the machine I just throw in the detergent, not into detergent holder. Once repair tech told me to try that for better washing. I think he was right.
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I fill the dispenser then add some on the silverware. Machine cleans much beter this way:)
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On Thursday, May 29, 2014 7:12:36 PM UTC-4, bob haller wrote:

That makes sense, most dishwashers have a little cup for adding some extra for the pre-wash cycle. But if you don't add any to the main dispenser, as was suggested by another poster, then you don't have detergent for the main wash cycle. Mine have always filled, run a quick cycle to get the loose stuff, then they pump out and refill. With no detergent to be released after that, you have no detergent for the main wash.
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On 5/29/2014 4:53 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:

Rinse agents contain surfactants, much more complex than vinegar. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfactant If you have soft water, vinegar may be adequate, but for most of us, we need better for top quality results.
I use the commercial stuff and get outstanding results.
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On Thursday, May 29, 2014 4:55:39 PM UTC-7, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Ed, I read the wikipedia article (most too technical for lay people) but did not spot any reference to the rin$e agents we are talking about; only discussed DETERGENTS as surfactants.
???
UH
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On 5/30/2014 1:22 PM, Higgs Boson wrote:

The rinse agents are made up of surfactants.
From the jetdry website (http://www.jetdry.com/faqs.shtml ): JET-DRY® products are a special combination of nonionic surfactants, a chelating agent, dye, and fragrance* (*for our fragranced products). On a more detailed note, they are kosher and don't contain phosphate.
Watch out with home made brews http://wholenewmom.com/whole-new-budget/natural-dishwasher-rinse-aid-important-update/ See, the rinse aid compartment was still full of green-colored vinegar even thought I hadn’t refilled the compartment for maybe 4 months or so. Well, the repairman told me something that I had no idea about. The acid in the vinegar can damage the rubber components in the rinse aid compartment.
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 2:59:08 PM UTC-4, Higgs Boson wrote:

I never use the dry setting. When it's done, I just crack open the door 6 inches or more and let the hot steam out. A lot of the water goes out and I leave the door open until it dries out, several hours or overnight, etc.
I wouldn't be surprised that the issue with the heated dry option is that they are trying to meet govt mandates for energy efficiency. Heated dry is going to hurt energy efficiency, so they probably minimize it, where years ago they ran it long enough to make sure they were dry.
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 5:05:24 PM UTC-7, trader_4 wrote:

[...]

What does that mean? "A lot..." has it drained?
and I leave the door open until

Hmmm...verry interesting. Where can I check further into your suggestion?
HB
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 8:26:46 PM UTC-4, Higgs Boson wrote:

Of course it's drained. But it's still hot and when you open the door a lot of the remaining water comes out as moist hot air. You get all that hot wet air out and it gets replaced by normal air, helping to dry the dishes out while they are still hot. When they are hot, any water on them is going to evaporate faster. Then you just leave it open for a few hours or overnight and they are dry. No dry cycle needed.

Check more? Just try it.
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On 5/26/2014 8:05 PM, trader_4 wrote:

Your method works if you are there to open the door when the cycle is done.
Our new Kitchen Aid has heat as an option, but we use it all the time. It has a Pro Wash and Pro Dry setting and does it all automatic. With Cascade Platinum, dishes come out perfect and sparkling. But I also paid 3X what the OP paid so it damned well better do a good job.
Oh, the new machines are energy saving, but take longer. Cycle is about 4 hours.
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Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Hi, Our Whirlpool DW lasted 20 years and was still running well when replaced. Only thing in 20 years it needed new motor/pump assembly I paid 40.00 at eBay. Now new one is Bosch which is dead quiet when running. We just use normal wash cycle and cleans, drys very well. We did not want cutlery basket on the door tho.
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On Monday, May 26, 2014 9:46:27 PM UTC-7, Tony Hwang wrote:

Too ****ing long! I NEED those dishes.

I didn't either! POS; always falling out & getting in the way.
Anybody think that door cutlery basket not getting dry is because of position???
HB
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