Deck screws in PTW wood

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| I am doing a test on this as we speak | It has been going on for close to 2 years and I haven't seen anything | unusual yet. | This is sitting on the south side of my screen cage, out in the yard. |
http://gfretwell.com/ftp/PT%20lumber%20test%2010-25-13.jpg
That looks interesting. Too bad you can't sell it to Consumer Reports. :)
One comment: Personally I have found that galvanized screws, equivalent to drywall screws, can rust away. I don't think the problem is so much the rust per se as the thinness of the screws. They can't afford *any* rust. I wouldn't use them at all for joist hangers because they have little shear strength.
Similarly, I like to use coarse drywall screws for light framing because they're easy to remove and a lot less work than hammering. But I wouldn't use them where strength is needed. They just don't have anywhere near the shear strength of a 16d nail.
The coated screws are heavier guage, though they haven't been around long enough to know how they hold up.
I don't have a nail gun. Sometimes I think I should buy one, but there seem to be 3 sizes to cover all nails. It's a lot of money and I'm always doing different things, so it's hard to justify. (I might frame for 1 day on a bath remodel and spend one day doing trim, with 6 weeks of other work.) But another hesitation for me with nail guns is that they compress the wood as they go through. Time and again I see where a nailgun was used to put in twice the typical number of nails, yet they're not holding well because they've essentially pre-drilled a nail-size hole on their way in. On the other hand, anyone used to using a nailgun would have a very hard time accepting that criticism because the time and effort they save is so substantial.
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I have always used galvanized nails that are made specifically for joist hangers. They're short (maybe 1.25 inches) but thick (like a 16D nail).
I believe Simpson makes screws specifically for joist hangers (Strong Screws). They're harder and are designed for high sheer strength. I've used the larger versions of the Strong Screws for seismic tie downs and they are very strong. I've used them many times as a quick substitute for lag bolts.
I don't believe codes allow anything else for hangers, certainly not drywall screws or deck screws. Not only are they weak and brittle, but they can have galvanic reactions with different metal hangers that will cause them to corrode prematurely.

Drywall screws are incredibly weak and brittle. Heck, they break quite often just installing drywall. Very thin shafts and no rust resistance.
I do use the gold screws (essentially a pretty drywall screw) for quick little projects though, like jigs or to temporarily hold something together.

I've been using coated "deck" screws for at least 15+ years. Some brands are good, others don't seem much better than drywall screws. The newer 10 gauge screws with torx heads seem quite sturdy. I wouldn't use them for building a house (too slow to drive all those screws), but use them frequently for decks and other small framing projects.

I have a framing nailer that I use for both 16D nails for framing, and 8D nails for siding. One gun basically covers all of my framing needs.
Of course, when I move indoors to trim work I need another gun to drive 16 gauge finish nails.
For woodworking, I use a third gun for smaller 18 gauge brad nails.
I've thought about getting a pin nailer too, but just haven't had the need. The three guns I have seem to work fine for everything I've wanted to do.
I can see where a palm nailer would be handy too... :)

I find the nail gun is far less likely to split thin boards than if I try to drive a finish nail by hand. Speed is a bonus too, as is being able to hold a board with one hand and nail it with the other. Strength is rarely an issue for trim work, and can actually be a benefit when you need to remove the trim for repairs or other tasks.
For framing work, you can get much better holding strength by using ring shank nails. They probably don't have the same pull resistance as a rough galvanized nail, but either nail is relatively easy to pull straight out. It's best not to rely on the withdrawal strength and more on the sheer strength. Framing nails hold things together, but nailing sheathing and subflooring to the faces of the framing is what really keeps them from pulling apart.
Anthony Watson www.mountainsoftware.com www.watsondiy.com
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On Fri, 18 Sep 2015 08:44:47 -0400, "Mayayana"

I disagree about the nail gun. They slam the nail in with one big push and they are a lot harder to pull out than a hammer driven nail. People tend to use more nails because it is so easy to do. I ended up with the 3 you allude to but one is a roof nailer. My big framing nailer shoots up to 3.25" nails and the smaller one shoots up to 2.5". The roof nailer shoots roofing nails. I also have an 18ga brad nailer tho. I probably use that one the most.
I just put a deck down with 2,5" ring shank SS nails. We will see how that works.
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I watch an acquaintance install joist hangers on a new deck. Not understanding what he was doing, I asked. He said he was using a palm nailer. I'd never heard/seen one before, so asked him to elaborate. It's a air driven device that hammers, in small rapid air driven strokes, nails into wood. He was driving what looked like < 1-1/2" to 2" galvanized nails. Blew me away! 8|
nb
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in a stick built house has a clip and most have a bunch of nails. (sole plate to stud, stud to top plate and a strap over the truss) If you do that kind of work you get the "direct placement" adapter for your small gun. It will put a nail in the hole every time.
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On Fri, 18 Sep 2015 08:44:47 -0400, "Mayayana"

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Thu, 17 Sep 2015 19:56:15 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

You aren't kidding. And, that's a polite way to put it.
--
Optimist: Someone who doesn't know all the facts yet.

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| > I'm in New England. Lots of weather extremes. | | You aren't kidding. And, that's a polite way to put it. |
It has its good points. I like the way that the cycles evoke reflection. September brings lust for life, a sense of loss, missed opportunity and sadness at the end of Summer. November brings sense of death with ugly, dead, brown landscape. Winter has cozy lunches of delcious soup. Spring is always amazing after the long Winter. Summer is more beautiful than just about anyplace else I know.... If I were in San Diego I guess I'd just get up every day to sunny room temperature. I expect that would get old.
Today it was 90F. By Monday they're predicting a high in the mid 60s. Over the weekend I've got to figure out what I did with my long pants. :)
But I do dislike what the salt does to car frames.
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On 9/17/2015 1:15 PM, Mayayana wrote:

I built a small deck recently using deck screws. Pre-drilled the holes when it was on the edges of the planks, but everything else went in easy without pre-drilling. Every deck we've built we used screws even the deck we built around our above ground pool. When we sold the pool, we sold the deck with it and the boards just had to be unscrewed and carted away.
--
Maggie

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| When we sold the pool, we | sold the deck with it and the boards just had to be unscrewed and carted | away. |
That's the one argument I can think of in favor of screws. Easier to take apart. I can't think of any other reason. Those holes you didn't pre-drill will end up with mini-splits and water will pool in the countersink, rotting the wood further. Flat head nails will virtually disappear because they're pretty much on the same plane as the wood.
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On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 14:15:05 -0400, "Mayayana"

If you pre-drill for screws the wood won't split. I don't surface nail or surface screw my decks. Deck clips work fine with hot galvanized roofing nails - and you don't see them. On my composite deck I used the plastic clips with stainless screws. Deck railing assembled with nails doesn't last very long. Screws hold more in tension than nails.
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| Not much of a carpenter or woodworker, I see. |
Apparently not, unlike yourself, who seem to have had a career in virtually every trade. :)
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On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:22:05 -0400, "Mayayana"

those.
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On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:57:52 -0700 (PDT), Uncle Monster

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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Jack of all, master of none?

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wrote:

technician. In connection with those 2, add teaching, propane service, window service, air conditioning,and building maintenance (plumbing, electrical,) etc Growing up with a father who was an electrician and building contractor, as well as growing up working on the farm added a few other skills. Then my hobbies over the years of restoring/hot-rodding cars and building an airplane - - - - - About 50 years of work experience.
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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Class of '64 Engineering school, SNU Korea, mandatory service for two years in ROKA field artillery unit. Joined U.S. DOD as a military civilian in radio telecom. with 8th US Army, 304th LL Bn. traveled overseas, reached GS-13 when I quit. Settled in Canada, joined Honeywell as field engineer >> Sr. systems specialit when I retired after 37 years. 5 more years on retainer doing cosulting work. Basically one career in the same field. Wife spent little over 30 years as a RN and anesthetist. She started her own business which is still going on strong. At the peak, had 4 stores, down to one now in our old neighborhood.
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On 9/17/2015 7:09 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

We should all have a coffee mug that lists all the different careers we've had over the years.
--
Maggie

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I think my wife would be in the running.
She stated out in a grocery store as a night stocker then Pharmacy assistant Guard Unloaded hogs at Rudy's Sausage in Arkansas Loading dock manager in Tampa Lab tech at Fox Electronics in Ft Myers sold carpet Owned a florist shop (FTD master florist) Floral manager Publix Sold landscape Sold Safety supplies (Zee truck) Sold advertising at the local paper Sold Health Life and annuities Retail store asst manager (home goods 2 places) Sold HVAC systems (Trane top 10 performer 2 years in a row) Built over 100 houses and brought a community out of the ground Now site manager at a gated commmunity/country club and looking around for something else.
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On 9/17/2015 10:48 PM, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

She's going to need an extra large coffee mug!
--
Maggie

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