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On Fri, 05 Mar 2010 22:03:45 -0600, in alt.home.repair, Red Green

No ex-smoker was as surprised as I was after I quit. I've been around car and diesel exhaust all my life, yet there is *something* about tobacco smoke that is distintive and completely different. Bring me someone who was around a smoker a week ago, and I can point him out. Show me someone who thinks he can hide his smoking from his spouse, I'll show you someone who was busted from the first minute. When you're in it, you can't notice it...when you're out of it, you can't help but notice it. It's more pervasive than anything I've ever known.
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I had a contractor a couple weeks ago, who said he didn't smoke. I went to chat with him, and he opened the door of his truck. Well, the tobacco auora was really obvious to me.
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

The nice people who smoke are respectful and understand but there are those afflicted with that "fuck you" attitude who have caused the rash of laws to be passed affecting the right of all adults to damage their bodies any way they choose. There is such a thing as personal responsibility, you will suffer the consequences for bad behavior, not just your own bad behavior but the bad behavior of like minded people. People who smoke who feel their rights are being violated should be mad at the asshole smokers who have brought about the crackdown. It's such a simple concept to understand.
TDD
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Oh yea. They piss me off. Like the ones who flip butts on the ground when there's a disposal nearby. Heck, if I'm in someones yard and there's no disposal around, I knock the head off and carry it with me.
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Red Green wrote:

It sounds like you're being respectful of others. I'm reminded of some experiments with the honor system, some newspapers will be put out on an unlocked rack with a coin box listing the price. A certain class of people with class (no pun) will unfailingly pay for the paper they take but inevitably, the papers and or coin box is stolen. I think the number of jerks in the population is increasing. That's why I like the concept of two legged vermin traps.
TDD
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The Daring Dufas wrote: ...

I don't think the reason behind present spate of smoking bans is much at all related to attitudes/behavior of smokers rather it is the nanny-state mentality the do-gooders have engendered. I don't think the folks passing these laws give a flip about attitudes one way or t'other; they're all for we know better.
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dpb wrote:

covering health issues. Of course, we will all die someday, so the "end of life" rise in health costs eventually tolls. Personally, those with bad habits save the gov't. money (SS benefits) by dying sooner :o) OTOH, not justifying smoking but I'm wondering when the huge increase in obesity (many non-smokers and quitters) will overcome the savings in illness and/or dollars brought about by smoking cessation. Smoking (and some other really bad habits) came about, in part, to decrease appetite.
The US has lots of insane practices that cost us dearly, like "sex sells"...sexually explicit ads geared to teens, crap food ads geared to toddlers, and pharmaceuticals that nobody in their right mind would use.
Of course, three of the four major resources that built this country are outlawed or unpopular....sugar, tobacco, slavery and cotton.
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is actually a money maker for governments. While they lose money in the short run to higher medical costs, etc., they more than make it back from the savings related to their dying younger.

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wrote:

I doubt there are even that many short term medical costs. Most smokers avoid the doctor because they get preached at to stop smoking.
They live in denial about their ailments until they are on death's door and die soon after that.
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

No wonder. It is proven smokers have quite a bit lower IQ compared to non-smokers. They are big burden to our health care system.
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wrote:

That is the myth but not true in the long run because they die before they have all the expensive old age procedures like cataract operations, hip replacements and all those pills old folks take. The burden on "entitlements" is far less. Non-smokers may live to be 100 but a smoker might not even get to Social Security and Medicare.
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

We have to look at it two ways. Even tho they live mostly shorter life they have more ailments of various kinds than non-smokers. How many fire is caused by careless smoking resulting in loss of life and property? They stink. Their house inside stink, their draperies don't last long. And second hand smoking is as deadly. In my city only place they can smoke is inside their house.
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Most of the fire deaths, though, are the person doing the smoking. Also fire related deaths from smoking run about 2300 a year. Hardly a major contributor to overall deaths. The loss in property is

I am skeptical of some of the second hand smoke proclamations, largely because the first big one (appeared in JAMA or New England Journal of Med.. I'd have to dig it out) cooked the books. They used a 90% confidence interval. Most studies (including almost all of them used in the analysis) use a 905% CI.
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Tony Hwang wrote:

Let's outlaw fireplaces while we're at it...they stink up the whole neighborhood. As for second hand smoke, I doubt it does more harm than gas-guzzling SUV's.
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snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net wrote:

Hell, tobacco does indeed enslave people!
TDD
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The Daring Dufas wrote:

In my house we treat 3 things like poison. Sugar, Salt, Milk.
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The Daring Dufas wrote:

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On Sat, 06 Mar 2010 11:05:35 -0500, " snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net"

You're close; think TAXES.

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wrote:

cotton isn't "unpopular" or outlawed....just not profitable compared to foreign sources. Tobacco and slavery are immoral.
Now,in addition to the secondhand smoke problem.... People who smoke are overwhelmingly LITTERBUGS; they toss their cig butts all over the place,along with the rest of their smoking trash like disposable lighters,wrappers and empty cig packs. The scumbags empty their ashtrays in parking lots. Now,some fool is going to say that it's only a few bad ones who toss their cig trash,but the vast amount of evidence alongside our roads and outside building entrances says otherwise.
They also start fires.
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There is still a *lot* of cotton farmed in this country.

Tobacco can't be immoral. How can a plant have morals?

Some people are immoral, that isn't to be denied.

I see a lot of beer and soda cans around, too.

Not to mention fast food wrappers and a whole host of other things. Let's shut 'em all down!

So does lightning. Let's ban that too.
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