Contract fell thru - need advice

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It turns out the contractor we hired to paint our house is unreliable. He managed to get the primer on and some of the trim. The problem is that the can states that the top coat must be put on within 30 days. Is it absolutely necessary to stick to 30 days time limit? What would happen if it is 1 or 2 weeks over?
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I would be more concerned that the unreliable painter would appear in a week or two wanting to be paid for the whole job. It's called a mechanic's lien that starts when he does any work on the job. Unless you have a written contract which states that failure to appear constitutes abandonment of the job, you are at risk. Unreliable is a value judgment on your part that will not hold up in court if he sues you for the entire contract price.
On 7 Jul 2006 06:28:22 -0700, " snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com"

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On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 08:37:35 -0500, Thomas Kendrick

And it goes without saying that if you refuse to pay, he can sell your home and get his money from the proceeds. But the good thing is that he will have to give you the balance - after deducting all the expenses of the sale.

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JimL wrote:

A lien doesn't give him the right to foreclose, merely to be paid when/if the property is sold.
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dadiOH
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wrote:

Wrong again.
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Find out what primer was used and go read a label, some state 6 months.
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How's that? In NV we Have Homestead Exemption that explicitly prohibits your home from being sold for debt you owe.
A lien is just a cloud on the property and needs to be cleared before sale.
Oren
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There may be exceptions to what I said in each of the many jurisdictions, but that doesn't change the general rule which is true in most jurisdictions in this country.
"MECHANICS LIEN - A claim against real estate made by a contractor, subcontractor, or supplier of building materials who contributed to improvements built on the real estate. A mechanics lien, if enforced, permits the party who filed the claim to force a sale of the real estate to pay the claim. "
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A contractor will have to stand in line; after mortgage lenders. So if I supply the paint, what is the point except I owe him for labor, right?
If everyone owed money today; forced a sale, we would have night court with long lines.
A contract breach doesn't turn into foreclosure... promissory note to the bank is another issue.
Oren
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I wish I lived in your world, Oren. You have such an innocent view of things.
I'm sure if I took the time, I could find you where some contractor sold a million dollar property to satisfy a $500 bill that the owner ignored.
It's old news and old law. Right now, what is hot is the home owners association selling million dollar homes because owners didn't pay a $150 maintenance fee.
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And a hard head. I'm not taking away from the right of the contractor to do what is lawful in Civil Court. If that's innocent I'm guilty.

I'm not picking it apart. You said before wrong and then see the exception, okay your guy won.

Our association has been fining a guy in our area for a very long time. The fines, and I guess interest grows each year. It was over the color of the paint in the fascia board.
Bottom line - they cannot foreclose, but will have the lien when he tries to sell. The guy will loose in the end.
So we have exemptions and some states don't.
Oren
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Even worse, In my state, there is no court action required. The whole thing from beginning to end (sale) can be done without any court being involved..

In my state, they have sold many homes causing great surprise and heartache to the owners. The law of the land right now in my state is that they can do that legally. Our state has just added new redemption rights and more notice provisions, but it is still legal to sell at foreclosure for not paying annual association dues.
Of course, it also clouds the title.....

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JimL ( snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net) said...

Only if there is no other title on the property. If you hold a first mortgage, the lender of that COMES FIRST and they are the only one who can force the sale of the property. A mechanic's lien waits in line, so if the mortgage lender is happy with the situation and is not interested in foreclosing, the contractor can wait until the cows come home.
If you ever pay off the mortgage before selling the property, the mortgage is discharged and any other interests move up the queue, possibly putting the the contractor in first position, who could then force a forclosure if you are not paying them.
Should you sell the property, all interests must be discharged before the deed can be transferred, so the contractor would have to be paid or somehow made happy enough to discharge the lien before the sale could be completed. If you refuse to do what is necessary to discharge the lien, then the purchaser of the property will have grounds to start an action against you.
<OBdisclaimer> I am not a lawyer, but I sometimes play one on a local talk radio show! ;-) </OBdisclaimer>
After building my own home, I have had some personal experience in this area. The company I contracted with to install our HVAC automatically filed a lien on the property the day after I signed with them. The contract stipulated that NOTHING was payable until 3 months after completion, when it could be paid in full without interest, or billed through our natural gas bill over 12 years at almost that rate of interest (I wanted to use the first option!).
I only found out about this when our construction mortgage was being processed. The initial draw was to pay off and discharge the vendor take back morgtage on the lot. Since the lien was there, the lien would move into first position. I was able to successfully argue with the contractor that they had no right to register the lien until the money became due.
To get through the first draw on the construction mortgage, a postponement had to be issued on the lien (I was still arguing about whether the lien should even be there) so that the new lender could move into first position of interest on the property when the original mortgage on the lot was discharged. In the end, as I said, the lien was discharged at the contractor's expense AND they reimbursed me for my lawyer's fees for handling the postponement.
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Calvin Henry-Cotnam
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On 08 Jul 2006 01:05:31 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@remove.daxack.ca.invalid (Calvin Henry-Cotnam) wrote:

Not so in most states.
For instance, In Texas, a Mechanics Lien for labor and materials can easily be taken to court and the property foreclosed, even though there is a valid prior recorded lien. You foreclose on the property by going to court with your M&M lien and the property is ordered sold by the court. The prior lien is not affected by the sale. That means that the buyer at the M&M foreclosure sale takes the property encumbered by the prior lien. In actuality, the prior lien holder becomes involved early on because they want to protect their rights.
In Texas, the prior lien is a Deed of Trust lien which means that the holder of the note can foreclose without court intervention by selling the property between the hours of 10am and 4 pm on the courthouse steps. The M&M proceeding are almost always a triggering mechanism so the original lender can foreclose.
My point is that the M&M lien is VERY serious business and if you are not careful, you can lose your home to a foreclosure sale.
Here is some actual Texas code:
--

" 53.123. PRIORITY OF MECHANIC\'S LIEN OVER OTHER
LIENS. (a) Except as provided by this section, a mechanic\'s lien
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Oren wrote:

We have (almost) the same homestead rule in Texas. The property can, however, be seized and sold for three types of debt: 1. Incurred for the original purchase; 2. Taxes; 3. For improvements to the property.
Plus, there are requirements that must be met before the property can even be considered to be a homestead (you have to actually LIVE there, for one).
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wrote:

Florida's Homestead Exemption (moons ago) exempted the first 25K from property taxes.

Promissory Note (s).

IRS and state...

Funds not paid to the local boards. like permits..

As I do, never claimed it for rentals.
Oren
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wrote:

No. You don't have to live there to establish it as your homestead.
However, you do, if confronted, have to prove your 'intention' to live there and make it your homestead. Maybe drill a well or lay out stakes for a foundation or some such action on your part.
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Oren wrote:

Oren Now your closer to correct because you have specified the state under which the law will be applied. You do know that the Nevada law is not identical to the law in the other forty nine states don't you?
--
Tom Horne

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On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 16:03:52 GMT, "Tom Horne, Electrician"

Yes, ever jurisdiction is different.
I've lived in four states and never once heard of a person owed money being able to take a person's home (foreclose) without some notice, civil action, etc.
I understand a lien, but I do not comprehend a contractor that is owed money being able to jump ahead in line of a mortgage lender that has interest in the property.
Foreclosure:
"The legal process by which an owner's right to a property is terminated, usually due to default. Typically involves a forced sale of the property at public auction, with the proceeds being applied to the mortgage debt. "
Lien:
"A mechanics' lien claimant can sue to have the real estate sold at auction and recover the debt from the proceeds. Because property with a lien on it cannot be easily sold until the lien is satisfied (paid off), owners have a great incentive to pay their bills."
Oren
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dadiOH wrote:

That varies from state to state and by property type. If you need legal advice go get it from a lawyer. Do not take the word of anyone hear because our advice is worth about what you are paying for it.
--
Tom Horne

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