Church without power

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With the forecast of Nov 13 being power cut, it gets me to thinking. I'm one of the maint guys at church. Suppose the power goes off, and it's below freezing.
The building is masonry, with some metal truss, and flat roof. Roof is flat rubber, think there is some styrofoam under the rubber. With freezing and rewarming, there is concern about the wall paper might be damaged by condensation when it warms up. But, the big damage is likely to be the water lines. Old copper, in the ceilings and along the inside walls.
Ideally, I'd be able to shut off the water at the meter where it comes in. Use a compressor and blow out adapter to blow most of the water out of the lines, and hope for the best. I do have a small pump, to pump in pink RV antifreeze, but that would likely take a LOT of pink. Ten gallons or more, at the very least.
What else should I be thinking, in terms of damage reduction?
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Christopher A. Young
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On 10/30/2013 09:16 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Will the church be occupied or no? I'm thinking portable heaters e.g. kerosene although you probably don't want to be in there while they're running. Unfortunately, you'll probably also get some lingering kero smell. I'd go ahead and drain the pipes too just in case.
Alternately, what *is* your heat and is it possible to power it up from a portable generator?
nate
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Nate Nagel wrote:

You should be able to rent a couple LP "Salamander" type heaters with thermostats to maintain a reasonable holding temp, and power them with a small generator like a Honda EU2000, which if you get one of the available extended run tanks for can let you refuel once a day if even that frequently.
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On 10/30/2013 2:13 PM, Pete C. wrote:

Yes,that's a good idea. There is some open area in the gym, I could blast a couple salamanders, with minimal risk of fire. Put some cinder blocks under the heaters.
If: 1) such heater can be found 2) can get permission to operate such.
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

The LP Salamanders require a bit of power, but at least they don't stink up the place like a kero heater will. I use a little 80k BTU/hr LP heater in my shop occasionally, it works well and only takes a few Amps to power the blower and ignitor.
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On 10/30/2013 5:13 PM, Pete C. wrote:

I'm sure LP is a lot cleaner. I've used kerosene, years ago. It does have a real odor to it.
LP is wonderful, for such purposes.
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One by product to LP combustion is H2O best plan on venting the enclosed space if the combustion is not exhausted to the out side.
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On 10/30/2013 10:16 PM, NotMe wrote:

And of course, venting to the outside loses heat. Can't win some times. I like the generator for smaller heat zone idea. Already vented. Well, if the natural gas remains on.
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On 10/30/2013 9:35 AM, Nate Nagel wrote:

CY:Probably not, during a power cut. I think they generally send everyone home. We had a day time winter power cut, years ago. They sent us all home.
I'm thinking portable heaters e.g.

CY: That did come to mind. I'd have to check the BTU, but the church has 7 zones. I think the smaller five are 250,000 BTU per hour input, 80% efficiency. Fire regulations (insurance) prohibit fuel burning portable heaters. I think also electric plug in heaters also prohib.
I'd go ahead and drain the pipes too just in case.
CY: And shut off the water heaters, so they don't burn up when power comes back.

CY: Natural gas. Two zones have huge 460/3 motors, five are 230/1 volt/phase motors. Might be able to borrow a 230 volt generator, and wire in. I don't personally have any thing that does 230/1.

CY: Thanks.
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

Your best bet, safest and simplest may well be to rent an industrial silenced diesel genset that can provide normal power for the heating systems, can be connected at one service entrance point and having a big fuel tank under the trailer mounted generator can be started up and mostly ignored until it's time to shut it down, fill the tank and return it.
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On 10/30/2013 5:16 PM, Pete C. wrote:

You know, that's one option. I suspect they will be hard to find (and seriously expensive) if the grid is down.
Easier to find someone with a gas generator that does 230/1.
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

You won't find many gas generators large enough to run the heating systems you have, generators large enough will be diesel or gaseous (LP/Nat.) fueled. A small gas generator can power some salamanders to provide a minimal level of "keep above freezing or condensation" heat.
FYI, those pivot irrigation systems commonly found in the mid America food producing states run on 480/3. One offshoot of that is that some engine driven welders are setup with generators that can provide 480/3 to power those systems when not welding them together.
Of course FEMA has huge warehouses full of nice diesel generators, I've seen semi loads of FEMA generators passing through here on the way up to OK when they had the huge ice storm there a few years back.
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On Wed, 30 Oct 2013 17:24:47 -0400, Stormin Mormon

If you are worried the grid will go down and you will need power, buy your insurance NOW. Book the genset and pay for it. Then you have it if the grid goes down. But if it is only for less than 48 hours, warm the building up real good on the 12th and then close the doors and keep them closed. It will NOT cool off to the danger point unless the exterior temperture dives WAY below freezing
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On 10/30/2013 9:29 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

I'm in a rough spot. If I contract for a generator and the grid stays up, then I'm in a world of looking bad. Won't be the first time. You're right to check the forecast a couple days ahead of time. The building is masonry, and some of the pipes are fastened to the outside wall (not designed for NYS). They have to keep the heat over 65 in the winter, or the pipes freeze.
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On Thu, 31 Oct 2013 07:35:32 -0400, Stormin Mormon

Don't know why ANYONE in Northern North America would EVER fasten water pipes to outside masonry walls. Even a 2 or 3 inch standoff reduces the freaze problem significantly. Or why anyone in that area would BUILD a non insulated masonry building if it required heating. It's just a big money pit.
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On 10/31/2013 5:44 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

I'm also not sure. Yes, it does take a lot of heat.
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Good shop vac might help as blowing out the lines does not always work.
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On 10/31/2013 11:09 AM, NotMe wrote:

Shop vac needs electric. Fortunately, I do have small generator. I'd be using a compressor, and blow out adapter. I've blown out RV / camper, and need to make a different adaptor to be able to pressurize a hose bib, other type of thread.
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On Thu, 31 Oct 2013 11:35:28 -0400, Stormin Mormon

If you don't have electricity, just use an air storage tank. Fill it at a gas station, if you have to.
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On 11/1/2013 12:32 PM, snipped-for-privacy@attt.bizz wrote:

Any building with seven zones, an "air storage tank" will be too small to do much good. Over head water pipes, four bathrooms, seven sinks, baptistry, outdoor hose bibs. Would you use five gal storage tank, or 7?
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