Since virtually every brand you buy is made in China you are pretty much getting a pig in a poke no matter what you buy. Quality control is virtually non-existant - and in a box of 10 you are liable to get 1 good one, one that won't light, one that dies within 4 hours, and 7 that start slow, flicker, and generally just drive you nuts.
I know what he said. You though, don't see what he meant. There is a difference in what people say and what they mean.
First off, using a CFL in a closet is not cost effective, but they could still be there. Be honest, do you really need 100% brightness to find a shirt in 15 seconds? Or is 92% really enough? Sure,if you want to read for an hour, you want full brightness, but in the situation described, a 15 watt bulb would get the job done.
Then don't. No one lighting is going to be ideal in every situation. No one here ever stated it would be. I have kitchen and dining room fixtures with decorative lighting, those 40W and 60W bulbs. I have no plans to change them, ever.
I see you use the word "many" as opposed to "all". I bet if you think about it, "some" may even be a better fit.
But you have the sense to use them to save energy. You made a decision that putting up with a few seconds of low light is better than paying a big electric bill. See, we are thinking the same way.
ooops, just when I thought we were on the same page, you made false accusation. Where did I say "CFLs fit all"? You won't find that at all. Sometimes people read words but extract meanings that are not there.
They are not dishonest, but more of a sin of omission.
I really think most of us to recognize that. In the heat of battle, that fact gets pushed aside. Anyone that says they are 100% for every situation is wrong, just as those that refuse to ever use one are wrong.
I tried CFLs some years ago and hated them and the ugly green cast of light. I put them out of my mind for years. One evening, we went to a local restaurant and I noticed the lighting was changed and it was quite nice. Bright, no glare, not dingy yellow. Turns out, they changed to CFLs. That week I bought some newer versions and put them in a few lamp that we use a lot. I won't change back because they light color is better than it ever has been. YMMV.
Makes sense. I suspect people with those "bath bar" type light fixtures with the big round globes are more predisposed against CFLs than those who have only used spirals. Something to keep in mind when shopping for bathroom light fixtures.
nate
Do you mean CFL's in a globe or globe-shaped CFL's'? I've got a "bath bar" over the bathroom vanity. No globes, 4 bare bulbs. I've got the Feit 75 watt (13 actual) spiral CFL's in there. Mentioned before I got a couple 18 bulb cases at Menards for 5 bucks a case. Since it was my son that bought them and the price is from memory, let's say 10 bucks for now. Either 28 or 56 cents a bulb. The same bulbs are in that fixture from at least a year ago. They produce full light when I flip the switch as far as I can tell. They get flipped on and off many times a day. The incandescents we used in there were always burning out. Besides that, the CFL's don't leave spots in my eyes after I glance at them. I'm pretty much sold on CFL's as long as they aren't too expensive. Doesn't mean others are. I don't have any recessed fixtures or outside instant brightness needs.
--Vic
Maybe when they have bulbs that are consistent and get to 92% right from the start, we'll find out. Until then, I've had lots of them that don't put out enough light for applications like that to not be annoying.
Also, based on what I've seen, regardless of what one poster says, I'm skeptical that any of them get to 90 brightness instantly. He claims that one was a GE made in China. I'll be looking for one when I'm shopping. But from past experience, these products change within a few months. They could find another China manufacturer that is cheaper, whatever, and you go buy a GE bulb 6 months from now and it's crap. In all the common household products I have to buy, this CFL thing has been the overall most frustrating and disappointing.
You sure seem to chime in every time implying that CFLs are wonderful and there is something wrong with guys like RBM and me that don't want to put them everywhere, like a closet. How about RBM has a 100W plain old cheap light bulb where he likes the light quality from it and he wants to just keep using it anywhere? Now he can't because the govt has banned them. What's next? Banning Big Macs and fries? You OK with that too? Or would it have been a better idea for the govt to just let people decide for themselves what they want to use? And to work with the industry to make sure the ones out there have uniform and honest ratings as to service life, time to
80% light output, etc. The govt could have published ratings showing results of performance testing. Instead they just forced them down everyone's throats.What I'm thinking is that the one that just blew out is going to be replaced by a regular bulb. Because the annoyance isn't worth it. And as far as saving electricity, what do you think about the many folks who have reported here that they now leave CFLs on 24/7 because they are cheaper to operate and they don't like to wait for them to warm up? I do that with some of them.
You may not say all. But you slammed RBM who has a perfectly valid point. And you've come at me before in kind of the same way, like I'm some biggot against CFLs for pointing out their significant drawbacks.
Then how about the fact that they are supposed to last XX hours, a very long time, which is written right on the box and almost all of them burn out in a fraction of it? The ones I've had have lasted about like regular bulbs. Is that being dishonest? I'm not the only one here that's experiencing that. Look at CL's post for example.
And maybe you're perception of light is different. I have never seen a CFL that was close in light quality to a regular one.
e
I meant the CFLs that look like globes (but really have a spiral inside.) That is undoubtedly what your fixture was intended to use (or else decorative round incandescents) and those CFLs are atrocious in terms of initial light output and warm up time compared to the regular spiral CFLs. However, they're more likely to be approved by the design department.
At my current place there's a similar fixture but it has spirals in it. No problems. It's not design-department approved, but I don't really notice it unless I look at it.
n
Why not get facts. The 100W incandescent bulb is not banned. Go to the store and you can buy them.
Dumb to do, but I can't stop them.
I uncovered the real reason. I think it is true of may of the posters against CFL. They tried them 10 years ago and did not like them (nor did I) and refuse to acknowledge they have improved. Some just don't want the governments telling them what to do. Now I agree with that, but I'm going to state it as such, not find excuses and blame the bulb when there is a different underlying cause.
That is entirely different. A couple of bulbs did not last all that long, but the others I've used have been in place for a very long time. Overall, my experience with bulb life has been very good and I changed a all the night lights in our plant and warehouse to them. They are on 24/7 and that may be a factor in the long life. The maintenance guys like them for that reason too.
No, my perception has not changed. I really like the new ones, really hated the old ones. The color temperature has changed in the past few years. I do some photography and I learned a lot about quality of lights, natural and artificial from that.
BTW, at work I only turn the lights of my office on for an hour on winter mornings. I much prefer the natural light from the two windows behind me. We has skylights put in the shop ceiling too.
Interesting forum. I took the time to document my useage of all. I learned that I have many more than I thought. RV Building= 10-100W CFL (Cool White) Outer Garage= 6-100W CFL (Cool White) Site Pole Lights= 6-100W CFL Bug Light Porch/Exterior Doors= 5- 60W CFL Bug Light Security on Motion Det= 5-150W Inc Flood General Site= 2-250W HPS Attached Garage= 4- 60W CFL in GDO's (Cool White) Attached Garage= 8- 2 lamp 40W Fluorescent (CoolWhite) Laundry Room= 2- 2 lamp 40W Fluorescent (Warm White) Breakfast Room= 4- 60W CFL & 1-100W CFL in fan (Warm White) Kitchen= 10- 100W CFL in Recessed Cans (Warm White) Dining Room= 5- 100W CFL Dimmable (Warm White) Living Room- 4- 100W CFL in Lamps (Warm White) Family Room= 10- 60W CFL in 2 Fans (Warm White) MBR= 4- 60W CFL in Fan (Warm White) MBath= 10- 60W CFL in Vanity Fixture (Warm White) MBath= 3- 60W CFL in Enclosed (Warm White) Library= 20- 100W CFL Trac Lights (Warm White) Halls, Stairs, Baths, BR's, Desk Lamps, Lamps 14-100W CFL,14-60W CFL, 2- 40W CFL (Warm White) Utility Rms 8-100W CFL (Cool White)
In Stock CFL=8-100W, 8-60W (Warm White) Incandescent 120-100W, 40-60W, 12-25W
Failures since 2004 3-60W CFL, 1-100w CFL
No issues with any as to warm-up, initial brightness, etc. About 90% GE and remainder are mfr test samples.
I do have the facts. And the facts are that the law passed years ago does ban the "plain old cheap 100Watt light bulb." A new law passed a few weeks ago just bans spending money to ENFORCE the law for a period of 1 year.
See, there you go again. Because you think I should put up with the inconvenience of stumbling around in a cold garage, unable to see enough for a minute+ to find the tool I'm looking for I'm dumb. Then, when I say there are some folks that think CFLs are good for all applications, you say "I didn't say that".
As I've stated, I've bought more recent ones and the results, while better, are still all over the place. I'm not alone here. Go back and read and others have said the same thing. A few people are reporting remarkably good results, but that hasn't been my experience.
A friend for example, recently bought some for his kitchen and is totally unsatisfied with the color of the light. He bought the ones alleged to be the warmest color and the light looks like crap compared to an incandescent. He thinks so. I think so. Is it because we're some kind of biggots? I think not.
Unfortunately, I don't live in a warehouse. For that application, they could be perfectly fine. Which is why I've said all along they are good for some applications and suck for others. Yet, when I choose not to use them for a garage that gets cold, and where I don't want to leave them on 24/7 you call me dumb. Go figure.
I mean maybe your perception of light is different than mine or the guy next door.
I really like the new ones, really
Must be firmly entrenched bias against CFL.
100w incandescent=color temp of 2700 Kelvin. 26W GE CFL soft white=color temp of 2700 Kelvin. Blind source test at University indicated inability to determine which was CFL.
What I have found with major consistency in terms of trends:
CFLs with outer bulbs tend to start worse-dim and need more time to warm up. The upside of those is that they are designed to work well over a wider temperature range.
CFLs with bare tubing (especially wider-width tubing around 12-15-16 mm wide) tend to be less-bad at starting dim. Bare-tubing CFLs tend to reach their "ultimate temperature" much more quickly than CFL tubing within outer bulbs.
If you have a strong dislike of CFLs due to warmup requirements, need to tolerate short on-time, or "the like", Philips has some somewhat-attractive LED products available at Home Depot. The brighter ones of those even have high color rendering index and rating for safe use with the usual-type of dimmers.
There is the matter that the "incandescent ban" has one of its many exceptions being for meeting/exceeding an energy-efficiency standard, that all 3 of the "Big 3" meet. So far at least, Philips at Home Depot, Sylvania at Lowes, and GE at Target.
There must be some morons at University (sic).
...
Well, they were blind. What would you expect? :)
I have them in all our bath fixtures - the round globe kind - in the 3, 4, and 6 sockets - alternate CFL with incand -
can't tell the difference after the warmup of about 60secs.
Whooosh.... :)
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