Bryant propane heater can't possibly be wired reversed (red LED blinks constantly)

[Danny D.]

Troubleshooting advice requested, because the LED blinking constantly supposedly indicates that the heater is wired in reverse (which really isn't very likely, so I must be misinterpreting something obvious).

Heater worked last year (AFAIK).

It just started getting cold in California, so, the heater power was turned on, and ... and ... and ... uh ... um ... no heat.

Thermostat batteries are good:

Heater power is on and the blower blows but the red led blinks at a steady pace forever.

Checked that the switches inside were all on:

Checked that the fuse on the circuit board was good:

The sticker says constant flashes indicates reverse wiring:

But, there's no way the wiring was changed between last year & now.

Here's what it looks like inside:

I don't know where the model number is, so, I don't have a manual yet.

Debugging suggestions are requested, and very helpful. Thanks!

[Stormin Mormon]

Model number inside the case, in your machine probably on the inner ceiling. As to reverse polarity, you'd have to use a VOM to confirm the black is hot, white is neutral.

- . Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

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[trader_4]

According to that secret decoder table, it tells you what's wrong by blinking short blinks, followed by long blinks. Those continue indefinitely, in a pattern. So, are you saying it's not doing that, but instead it's giving you no pattern, just rapid flashes, which the table says is reversed polarity?

If so, best guess would be that the oontroller board is kaput. Did you have that flakey generator running it?

[Danny D.]

trader_4 wrote, on Fri, 19 Dec 2014 16:14:54 -0800:

Here is exactly what the blinking is doing with the cover off and me pressing on the door switch manually:

This is the secret decoder ring in a full-size JPEG file:

What do you make of those blinks with the cover off the unit?

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Fri, 19 Dec 2014 19:13:20 -0500:

Thanks for that advice.

I can check the polarity, but, really, there's no way it changed.

So, I must be interpreting the flashes incorrectly.

Here is the full-size secret decoder ring:

Given that, what do folks make of these flashes in this 30-second video while the cover was still on the unit?

[Stormin Mormon]

I could not tell if it was continuous, or blinking 11.

In any case, and open ground can some times give a fault code. I'd get out the VOM, and check for polarity and also check for open ground.

- . Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

.

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Sat, 20 Dec 2014 06:01:41 -0500:

If it's 11, then that corresponds to the following (which I don't understand). 11: NO PREVIOUS CODE - Stored status codes are erased when power (115V or 24V) to control is interrupted or 48 hours after each fault is cleared

What does that mean?

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Sat, 20 Dec 2014 06:01:41 -0500:

If it's continuous, that corresponds to: RAPID FLASHING - Line voltage (115V) polarity reversed. If twinned, refer to twinning kit instructions.

What does "twinned" mean?

[trader_4]

The video wouldn't play in Internet Explorer, just sound. In Chrome it played for me and clearly it shows 1 long flash, 5 short flashes, followed by continuous flashes. The other video, with the door on, just shows it flashing continously, no patterm.

Two problems. First the table says the codes are given by the number of long flashes and short flashes, which would lead you to believe the long flashes should come first, not the other way around.

Second, no matter, there is no table entry for 1-5 or 5-1.

The continous flashing with the cover on, in the other video, I would agree looks like line polarity reversed. Which for a previously installed furnace would appear to be virtually impossible. Another possibility would be that the control board was replaced previously with a different type that has different codes.

So, I agree, I'd check with a VOM to make sure AC is in order. After that, IDK. We don't know the sequence of what comes before those videos. If the furnace winds up with that constant blinking in the first video right after power has been removed, then turned back on, I'd say it's most likely the control board. If the light is just on steady, which I think is normal condition, and then when it goes to *fire*, he gets the

1 -5 sequence, then I'd say it's more likely something else, ie that it's detecting something wrong, like pressure, when purging. But why it's not in the list, the blinks seem backward, I guess that's just par for the course with the stuff at D's house.

[Danny D.]

trader_4 wrote, on Sat, 20 Dec 2014 05:19:01 -0800:

Thanks for taking a look at it, because I saw exactly the same thing.

The video with the door on was taken after it was running for ten or fifteen minutes, but with no heat, so I crawled into the crawlspace where the heater was and taped the flashing.

There was nothing whatsoever done with the line voltage of this furnace, at least not on purpose. No electricians came to the house. And nothing was done on the furnace whatsoever.

So, for the line voltage to reverse, that would be odd.

I can't tell if the continuous flashes are long or short.

I did see, as you saw, that the first few seconds of flashes were not the same as the rest of the flashes. I didn't know what to make of it, but you discerned a 1-5, which makes your timing better than mine.

Ah. I understand what you're saying. If the control board doesn't match the cover secret decoder ring, then that might explain a lot.

I'll snap a new "reboot" video today, with the power turned off to the furnace, for a few hours, and then turned back on and started right up so we get the "initial" sequence of flashes.

[trader_4]

It doesn't have to be turned off for a few hours, just turned off and back on. Record what it does when power comes back on without a call for heat. If it shows normal, stays that way for a few mins, then turn up the thermostat and see what happens.

Another thing, you're not operating the furnace normally. You have the cover off, furnace powered up and you're depressing the door safety switch to initite it. For all we know that 1 -5 sequence could mean "detected door switch open". Power it up with the door switch closed, either with the door on, tape over it, etc.

[Stormin Mormon]

Means that either someone turned off the power (so the unit lost its memory kind of like a VCR blinking 12:00) or that the fault was so long ago, that the unit lost its memory.

In any case, please try shutting off the power for 30 seconds or so, and turn it back on. Some times that handles nussiance trips.

- . Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

.

[Terry Coombs]

He might try blowing the control board off with compressed air . Dust , if damp , can short circuit those miniscule signals ... as I found out after buying a new board for my Goodman furnace . Now I have a spare .

[Tony Hwang]

Hi, I believe it is code 33. I am pretty sure.

[Danny D.]

Tony Hwang wrote, on Sat, 20 Dec 2014 19:41:51 -0700:

Thanks for looking as it's really hard to tell what the blinking indicates.

If it's 33, then that corresponds to:

LIMIT OR FLAME ROLL-OUT SWITCH IS OPEN- If open longer than three minutes, code changes to #13. Check for: - Defective blower motor or start capacitor - Loose blower wheel - Inadequate combustion air supply flame roll-out switch or fuse link - Open flame roll-out switch, or fuse link. Manual reset or replace. - Dirty filter or restricted duct system - Defective switch or connections

I'm not sure I understand all of those, but some are easy, e.g., I'll look for whereever the filter is (which has never been cleaned to my knowledge).

[makolber]

Some of these controllers sense the small electrical conductivity of a fire as a flame sensor. Since the fire is grounded, the flame sense ciccuot s enses to earth ground. To do that, the conntroller needs a good earth grou nd and it gets that through the ac connection. All 3 wires of the ac conne ction have to be correct. The black has to be hot. The white neutral and t he green or bare ground. Check that these 3 connections are correct, inclu ding the ground connection. Also chech that these is no sign of water on t he electronics. Also chcck the flame sensorrobe wire is not shorted or has water.

Mark

[Danny D.]

makolber wrote, on Sun, 21 Dec 2014 04:53:55 -0800:

The area is in a crawlspace that is *above* the house, so, it's pretty dry. At least, I don't see any moisture anywhere, even though it has been raining (thank God) outside.

[Stormin Mormon]

If this is the trouble code, you most likely have not enough air flow through the furnace, and the furnace is over heating. You might also have a clogged flue.

First step is to seek for the air filter, and replace it. Also see if the blower wheel spins while the furnace is on, and calling for heat.

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Sun, 21 Dec 2014 18:39:15 -0500:

I opened up all the vents, and removed all the filters.

Is this the "blower wheel"?

It spins freely manually (but never turns when the blower is running).

I also replaced the batteries, in the controller, even though they had tested at 1.4VDC open circuit (the new ones are

1.6 volts open circuit).

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Sat, 20 Dec 2014 09:45:08 -0500:

I turned the power off and then after a few minutes, back on. Nothing changed.

I tried to check voltages, but I don't know what to test:

The model is Bryant 373LAV024070, input 69,000BTU, output 66,000 BTU: