Adding a 2-wire receptacle with 12/2 wire

I have a house with 2-wire receptacles. From one of the 2-wire receptacles, I want to run a line to a new 2-wire receptacle that I am adding. The wire I have to run the line is 12/2.

The question I have is, "What do I do with the bare ground wire in the 12/2 wire?"

The original 2-wire receptacle box and the new 2-wire receptacle box are metal. I am assuming that I should NOT connect the bare ground wire to the metal box on either end.

Is that correct, or am I supposed to attach the bare ground wire to each metal receptacle box even though I don't know if either box is grounded?

Thanks.

Reply to
BETA-33
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what kind of line do you have BX 2 wire romex, K&T?

if its BX and good ground you can connect the ground to the box and begin upgrading to all grounded outlets

Reply to
hallerb

Check to see if the original metal box is grounded. The cheap little plug in testers will do the job. Depending on the age of the house you might have the early romex with ground and the metal boxes are grounded, but ungrounded receptacles were used. If that's the case you can convert to grounded receptacles with relative ease.

Reply to
Pete C.

attach them both to the metal boxes with a green grounding screw. fyi: if you want real grounding protection for both outlets you can install a gfci to the first one and run the other off of that, then both would be grounded.

-c

Reply to
Chris Miller

Interesting situation.

Ideally, you would like to follow the info given in the *second* Q2 at this site:

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You can replace the first outlet with a GFCI receptacle and then replace the downstream outlets with 3 pronged outlets, You won't gain an equipment ground, but you will gain protection for the users as well as the convenience of being able to plug in three prong cords without an adaptor. If the circuit isn't grounded, you shouldn't being using an adaptor anyway.

However, as noted at that site, the permission to use 3 pronged receptacles on an ungrounded circuit applies to existing receptacles only, not to new (branch-circuit extention) receptacles.

Feel free to use that information as you see fit.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

If the circuit isn't grounded to begin with, installing a GFCI won't cause it to become grounded. Installing a GFCI at the beginning of the circuit causes the circuit to be GFCI protected, not grounded

Reply to
RBM

if its BX and good ground you can connect the ground to the box and begin upgrading to all grounded outlets

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It is 2-wire (black and white) -- in a single non-metallic sheath. I don't know if that is called BX or whatever.

Reply to
BETA-33

I'll do that.

I am not looking to convert to grounded outlets right now. For now, I just want to add one receptacle. It can be a 2-wire like all of the rest of the receptacles as far as I am concerned, but that leaves me with the question of what to do with the bare wire in the 12/2.

Reply to
BETA-33

Your new receptacle should be ran to the service panel so that it will be grounded.

Reply to
Pat

No, that's Romex (trade name, but what they hey, it's what it's called).

If it's 12/2 w/no g, then the boxes aren't grounded (there's no ground to ground them with) so it really doesn't matter too much what you do w/ the new ground wire--it won't be grounded to anything, either.

But, it won't hurt anything (nor help anything, either, of course) to connect the ground wire to the metal boxes at each end. Then, if you do go back and add the ground back to the panel, that's done for the new one.

Reply to
dpb

Use a pigtail socket and bulb to test if the box is grounded, by touching the wires of the socket between the hot, black wire and the box. Some early NM cable had an undersized ground wire that was not connected to the box via grounding screw, but wrapped around the cable and clamped by the romex connector or pressure clamp

Reply to
RBM

if the OP has k&T things will get interesting here..........

Is the main fuses r circuit breakers?

Reply to
hallerb

re: that leaves me with the question of what to do with the bare wire in the 12/2

Well, the *easy* answer is to simply attach it to each metal box. If the circuit is grounded, your new recetacle will be grounded. If it isn't, no harm, no foul.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

. The first problem is pluging the tester in when the outlet should be 2 wire. Simple plug in testers can tell you there isn't a ground. They can't reliably tell you there is a good ground - they test with a very low current. RBM's idea of a pigtail socket and light bulb is better.

I agree that a GFCI outlet that protects the downstream outlets is a good idea. Downstream outlets can then be grounded type, even though they are not grounded. Mark them as in the Mike Holt link.

If there is no ground I would try to avoid attaching the ground wire to the boxes. If you had an event that makes one box hot they will all become hot. If you have a GFCI outlet and protected downstream grounded type outlets all the outlet grounds will be hot. (But the GFCI should protect you.) The bare ground wire could be insulated with tape.

Reply to
bud--

If your 2-wire electrical outlet is allowable, then just fold back the unused ground wire. Do not install a 3-hole outlet if it is not properly grounded. However since this is a safety issue, it would be a very good investment and wise to upgrade all 2-wire outlets to grounded outlets.

Reply to
Phisherman

yeah homes around here were all 2 prong 1950 vintage

I upgraded 2 to all grounded added GFCIs and helped some neighbors do the same. BX made it easy:)

Reply to
hallerb

new 2 prong outlets are still made but not commonly sold

Reply to
hallerb

According to Phisherman :

Code says that if you install a 3-hole outlet, it MUST either be properly grounded OR, have a GFCI upstream of it (and have a "protected by GFCI" sticker applied to the new outlet).

_If_ you're relying on GFCI instead of true grounding for a new 3 hole outlet, its box and receptacle grounding terminal MUST NOT be interconnected to any other ungrounded outlets, including the GFCI. So, if you use three wire to connect from an ungrounded GFCI to an ungrounded 3 hole outlet, the ground wire should (as Phisherman says) not be connected.

The reason for this being that if you have a series of outlets with ground interconnect, but no true ground, a hot-ground fault in any device on any outlet, makes all the other 3-wire devices on all of the outlets live. Which could even include plumbing segments (sinks, taps etc), appliance enclosures etc. At least with a GFCI, it should trip and prevent you getting electrocuted. Without a GFCI or if it fails ... ouch.

Reply to
Chris Lewis

My apologies for this suggestion. I stand corrected.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

re: Code says that if you install a 3-hole outlet, it MUST either be properly grounded OR, have a GFCI upstream of it

But doesn't code also say that the GFCI protection option is only available for existing receptacles? I've found conflicting info on the web, but most of the info I've found say the old circuits are grandfathered, but anything new (like the OP's) situation is not allowed to be simply protected by a GFCI and must be properly grounded.

Do you know the definitive answer?

Reply to
DerbyDad03

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