A/C drain line plugged, what to clear it with?

[HeyBub]

A. Nobody asked you.

B. Millions upon millions of homes can't all be wrong.

[Home Guy]

An obtuse observation based on the conversation thus far.

An HVAC in the attic is still not the best place for it - from a thermodynamic point of view if nothing else.

So you agree with me about that.

What - they don't have motors or fans or moving parts in them any more?

Really?

Tell us more.

So now everyone that has an hvac in their attic, according to you, has (a) a large, 2-story house (with a furnace in the basement and a furnace in the attic) and also (b) a large, walk-in attic.

I see. What a nice world you live in.

So your condensate pan requires no tools to access? It's right there- out in the open?

I see.

And you are garanteed that the beach will work?

(...)

I'd charge up my 5-gallon portable tank, connect air-hose and trigger-operated air gun, carry it down to basement furnace, shove nozzle of air-gun into 1/2" copper condensate line and wrap my hand around the end of the line to form a good-enough seal, pull trigger, remove air gun and observe water flowing out of line and into drain.

[Home Guy]

How does discussing *where* the hvac system is located in a house have anything to do with "knowing" about AC?

What a twisted thought-process you have to make such a statement.

[krw]

It's the best place for it for floorspace and duct layout.

Neither is the middle of the floor, the best place. Everything is a tradeoff. However, it's a *very* common place to put the EVAC unit in the South.

You no longer have to convince us just how stupid you are. We got it!

Most houses here have large attics. 12:12 is minimum in many places. My VT house is 15:12. DOn't know what it is in this house (haven't measure it - haven't even been in the attic yet). Yes, it's rather easy to walk around in the attic. It's a huge cavern up there.

[krw]

You obviously know little about the art.

Wow! You complaining about a "twisted thought-process". Now *THAT'S* funny!

[Home Guy]

What?

Millions of homes in the USA have their HVAC unit in the attic?

I still say it's a crazy-ass place to put it.

==================== Ductwork in an attic is normally the largest energy problem in the home or building.

The reasons why this practice should be avoided are comfort complaints, heating & cooling losses in the attic ductwork and air handler, higher energy bills, maintenance difficulties and system failures.

Most HVAC contractors install cooling systems in the attic based on the theory that cold air falls down. ====================

Really?

What a retarded theory.

Maybe they mean most American HVAC contractors install cooling systems in the attic for that cockamamee reason.

==================== However, the real reason most of them install them in the attic, is that it is a lot easier and less expensive to install the system. there are a number of problems with this type of installation:

ATTIC AIR HANDLER and DUCTWORK PROBLEMS:

1. The attic air handler and ductwork system is normally insulated to R-4 and is installed above the attic insulation causing minimal resistance to heat and cooling losses through the ductwork and air handler.

1. The size and cost of the system will have to be increased due to the cooling and heating losses through the thinner attic ductwork insulation. A larger system will be required to compensate for this inefficiency.

2. The systems will have to run longer to make up for the losses in the attic ductwork.

1. There is also inefficiency, due to the fact that the cooling system is generating cooling in the hottest part of the house and the heating system is generating heat in the coldest part of the house in the winter.

2. On a typical attic installation the temperature differential from the attic air handler unit to the supply register on the other side of the house can be as much as 8 degrees. This amount of cooling loss cannot be made up with just over sizing the system.

1. Additionally, most attic access doors/hatches are not insulated which will allow more winter heat to escape up into the attic.

2. The attic heat in the summer time will also migrate down into the house through the ducts and attic access, making the system have to run longer to cool the warmer air.

1. This design is very wasteful in the winter. The house heat will rise up by stack effect into the supply and return ducts in the winter, making the 10 inches of attic insulation mostly ineffective. This air will flow into attic ducts and air handler to be lost through the thinner insulation and leakage points in the ductwork.

2. The heating system will have to recycle on and off more often to make up for this stack loss.

1. Delivery duct leakage into attics increases the cost of operation because the system has to run longer to make up for the leakage lost to the attic.

2. Return duct leaks allow frigid winter air to be introduced into the system, increasing the heating load.

1. Return duct leakage in the summer pulls very hot humid air into the system, increasing cooling and dehumidification loads.

MAINTENANCE DIFFICULTIES:

In many attics the air handler system is installed in the corner, sometimes behind the supply and return ductwork. The only way to get to the filter for regular cleaning or replacement (monthly) is to climb over the ductwork, sometimes damaging the ducts. Most homeowners don?t even go into the attic to change the filter, even if the air handler is easy to access. Because of this hard to access filter, most filters are not changed on a regular basis, causing the filter and cooling coil to become dirty and clogged, reducing the efficiency and air circulation of the already inefficient system. The house will have increased operational costs and the furthest rooms from the air handler will not be cooled or heated efficiently or adequately. ====================================

Up here in Canada, we don't do crazy-ass things like put hvac units in our attics.

So what do we know about Americans so far?

1) They think it's normal to urinate in the sink - if only because it's more conveinent (remember my thread about installing urinals for residential use?) and

2) They think it's normal (even preferrable) to put the ac/furnace in the attic.

Oh yea:

3) Almost half of all americans with mortgages are under water (financially speaking - although many of you like to build homes on flood plains).

[krw]

Yes, that's what people have been telling you but you're too stupid to understand.

It's not.

[Home Guy]

[krw]

HomoGuy;s head inserted in his (and anyone who will bend over's) ass.

[trader4]

They sure do. Maybe that's because contrary to your notions, the USA is a country where a lot of people have big houses. And when you have a big, two story house, it's not unusual to have two HVAC units. One in the basement, one in the attic.

That's probably the best reason I've heard yet to put it in the attic.

Right there it's clear whoever wrote this doesn't know much about HVAC. That reason is about the dumbest I've heard.

Your the one citing it as a reference, not us.

I thought right above it's claimed that the main reason is that cold air fall down....

The above points are valid. Unfortunately, there is no mention of the positive reasons for putting HVAC in the attic.

Of course this one is flat out wrong. If X BTUs are lost in the attic, then off course you can increase the size of the system to make up for it.

Which of course has nothing to do with the topic.

Those are true.

Repeating now.

And if the air leaks out into an unfinished basement pretty much the same thing happens.

True, but then the leaks should be sealed.

True, but then the leaks should be sealed.

You could do a bad install anywhere.

You could do a bad install anywhere. The houses I've seen it done in access isn't a problem.

Then those homeowners probably won't change the filter if it;s in the basement either.

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

It probably causes smelly feet and cancer too.

What is missing in all this is a fair comparison with the other alternatives. In a large two story house the attic is a convenient place. It provides a space close to the area served and it's very easy to run the duct work. I've never seen an attic unit as the only unit in the house. One unit is in the basement, one in the attic. How do they do HVAC for a 4000 square foot house in Canada?

[Dave]

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message news:%Lzyr.25143$ [e-mail]...

Hey,thanks Chris. 10% sounds good. A couple days after my op, I got a bag of Power Shock from a pool store, which is 73% calciumhypochlorite. Had no idea of how much to use, but the entire 1# bag was supposed to treat 16500 gallons of water, which would return to normal Ph (sp?) after about 8 hours. Figured that worked out to 27 mg/gallon, so I measured 1/10 of a gram into a gallon jug and filled it half way with water (something like 1.7 % chlorine, I *think*.) Smelled exactly like the air around a pool. Poured that into the inlet I installed 10 years ago and let it drain. Finally decided this morning to quit fooling around and mixed up a half-gallon of 7% stuff (1 gram in a half-gallon of warm water) and am about to add it to the drain pan through the inlet I put in (don't know what else to call it.) Hopefully, this will clean out the crud growing in the line, which I will determine by whether or not I can close the 1/4 turn valve I also put in 10 years ago. Maybe after this I will remember to flush it out every six months or so, and avoid the whole problem further down the line. Maybe make it a New Year's thing, and do it when the new calendars come out. If it works well, I won't bother weighing the chemical in the future, and will just dump a level 1/4 tsp (which is about 1 gram) into the jug and add water before letting it set for a bit to dissolve. Am only typing all this to let people know what I am doing, in case it comes in handy for anyone else.

Don't *think* I got any of this backwards, but if anyone has questions don't hesitate to ask. It might take me a day or two to answer though.

Take it easy...

Dave

[Stormin Mormon]

Of course, you do realize that 10% means one part of clorox bleach out of the jug, and 9 parts water? Sorry, I didn't give you reference points, there.

I think the concoction you made was a wee bit too strong. Part of the problem, is that pouring clorox into the evaporator pan makes the house smell like a swimming pool. But, it does cut down on microbes.

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

.

"Dave" wrote in message news:cJSdnfakVdpKmU_SnZ2dnUVZ [e-mail]...

Hey,thanks Chris. 10% sounds good. A couple days after my op, I got a bag of Power Shock from a pool store, which is 73% calcium hypochlorite. Had no idea of how much to use, but the entire 1# bag was supposed to treat 16500 gallons of water, which would return to normal Ph (sp?) after about 8 hours. Figured that worked out to 27 mg/gallon, so I measured 1/10 of a gram into a gallon jug and filled it half way with water (something like 1.7 % chlorine, I *think*.) Smelled exactly like the air around a pool. Poured that into the inlet I installed 10 years ago and let it drain. Finally decided this morning to quit fooling around and mixed up a half-gallon of 7% stuff (1 gram in a half-gallon of warm water) and am about to add it to the drain pan through the inlet I put in (don't know what else to call it.) Hopefully, this will clean out the crud growing in the line, which I will determine by whether or not I can close the 1/4 turn valve I also put in 10 years ago. Maybe after this I will remember to flush it out every six months or so, and avoid the whole problem further down the line. Maybe make it a New Year's thing, and do it when the new calendars come out. If it works well, I won't bother weighing the chemical in the future, and will just dump a level 1/4 tsp (which is about 1 gram) into the jug and add water before letting it set for a bit to dissolve. Am only typing all this to let people know what I am doing, in case it comes in handy for anyone else.

Don't *think* I got any of this backwards, but if anyone has questions don't hesitate to ask. It might take me a day or two to answer though.

Take it easy...

Dave

[Fred McKenzie]

Dave-

My ten year old system suddenly started leaking all over the garage last year. Due to its construction/installation, it is not practical to access the evaporator pan.

I cut into the PVC drain and installed a coupling as close to the pan as I could. I had a slender plastic tool lined with barbs intended for removing hair from a sink drain, and fed it into the pan. There was no sign of anything there, so I assumed the pipe was blocked further downstream.

I now realize there is a trap under the house near where it exits to the outside. That is probably where it was clogged. It is hard to tell if it was clogged by an algae, or if a lizard had crawled in and died.

I took half of another PVC coupling and capped it with a plug. I drilled and tapped the plug for 1/4" NPT pipe thread and installed a quick disconnect coupling for an air hose. Connecting the coupling where I had cut the PVC drain, I fed it with 100 PSI from a portable air tank. That seems to have cleaned out the pipe. It has been draining nicely ever since.

I agree that a ten percent bleach solution should prevent growth of the algae, but I plan to just blow mine out once a year. If it should clog up in less than a years time, then I'll look at using a bleach solution after blowing it out.

Fred

[paurickgaughan]

Suck the drain pipe out with an aqua vac, and put a Gel-clear tablet in the pan, end of problem.

Your welcome!

[stoneonions]

Dave and others. I just had the AC guy here to do my aircon. It was dripping water from underneath.

We went outside to the condensation drain line/pipe. He had a suction hand pump [ i have seen them in america called mighty pump]. A couple of go's...and out came the blockage scum.

now working great. Have also seen people use wet/dry vac with a bit of cloth on the pipe to get suction for about 18 seconds on utube.

[Fred McKenzie]

If you search the web, you may find recommendations to occasionally add bleach to the AC's condensation pan. This keeps the scum from growing.

Mine started leaking when it was around ten years old. I was able to install a coupling in the plastic drain pipe near the AC unit, and a compatible coupling connected to an air tank. Filling the tank to 100 PSI and then dumping it to the drain pipe, seems to clean out any blockage. I do that about once a year to keep the line clear.

Fred