Elementary carpentry question

Alright, so this is Carpentry 101, but I'm gonna ask it anyhow.

Question concerns taking measurements where there is an inside corner: how do you do it accurately? F'rinstance, say you're sheeting the inside of a closet and are measuring the wall height from floor to ceiling. You put the bottom of your tape against the floor, climb up on your stepstool or whatever, then wrap your tape around the top corner of the wall. What then?

I mean, it's really hard to know just what exactly the actual height is. It *looks* like 93 5/8--no, make that 11/16--maybe 3/4--WTF?

It almost makes me want to build myself a little "story pole", two long sticks grooved together with a little clamp to take exact inside measurements. (I think a sliding dovetail would work nicely here.)

How do you handle this? How did carpenters do this in the olden days? What tricks do you use? How many times do you just cut a piece oversize, then trim to fit?

Reply to
David Nebenzahl
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Run the tape from floor to ceiling. Make your best guess at the total length. Now put a mark 24" down from the ceiling. Measure up from the floor to the mark. add 24". Compare the actual result to your estimate. Learn to estimate accurately.

Put the end of the tape on the floor and the body of the tape measure against the ceiling. Take your reading at the point where the tape exits the body. Look on the body for an indication of the size of the tape measure case. (3" is common) Add it to the reading.

But why are you concerned with running sheeting all the way to the floor? You _want_ to leave it shy of the floor a bit, and baseboard will cover the gap.

Reply to
Mike Paulsen

On 3/2/2011 10:16 PM Mike Paulsen spake thus:

I like that; brain training. Will do.

Just an example. A better example would have been cutting studs to fit tightly betwixt floor and ceiling. Point is that it's good to know the actual height instead of just guesstimating it.

Reply to
David Nebenzahl

The tape measure should be marked something like "Add 2 inches" on its case. Butt the end of the case into the corner and add it to the reading. Sometimes I cut a stick to exactly 10 inches or 1 foot and put that into the corner, then measure to the end of the stick with the tape. Don't forget to add the distance!

Reply to
Larry W

This is largely because walls tend to be neither square nor straight, so trying to cut paneling or drywall precisely will just drive you crazy.

Use the technique others described in this case. Or if you want to be even more precise, measure and mark 12" from either end with a metal ruler or square (because the metal hook on the ends of most tapes is designed to measure outside) and measure between the marks with your tape. Of course, this is probably more precise than you can cut anyway...

Reply to
Larry Fishel

If the measuring tape doesn't have an 'add X inches' on it, tape a 3" piece of wood/metal to the bottom of the measuring tape. Take the measurement at the end of your wood, and add 3". Even if your measuring tape has an 'add X inches', this can still be a good idea, as it tends to give a more accurate measurement.

Reply to
John

One way is to use an extensions rule. Stanley made a full set of them. I have them up to the #510, which reaches 10 feet. They are one of the old rules I often reach for.

Extension rules have two overlapping rulers which are ruled such that they read directly at the end of each one. They have an extendable hook for reaching to the top of a piece. Here are some photos:

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Reply to
DT

Set tape measure on floor with backside of measure facing floor and tape side facing up. Run tape up to top corner. Note measurement. Now, add the measurement given on case of tape measure. No stepstool needed.

nb

Reply to
notbob

Metal square on both ends is good, then measure between those marks starting at the inch mark on the tape. Tape is flat then, without the end tab run out screwing up the measure. I nearly always cut a bit oversize then trim as needed when I want a tight fit. Like you said, the saw cut can present its own problems. Thought the laser on my new saw was unnecessary. But I like it when not using a stop for repetitious cuts. Another thing about tapes besides end tab run out is the tab can easily get you off by 1/8" if the rivets loosen up. I hate it when somebody snaps in my tape hard!

--Vic

Reply to
Vic Smith

Yes, but the holes in the ruler get elongated by repeated snap closings.

Reply to
hrhofmann

do you have a pencil?

Reply to
chaniarts

Run out is the distance off a flat surface the tab causes. Just applied the term to it. Might be the wrong term. If the tab is 1/4" off the work you measure long. Some tabs are maybe 3/8" Might not be much, but even 1/32" misses a tight fit. I've had plenty of tapes that come with tight rivets in holes. And some with slots where the tab is meant to move. Doesn't matter if the hole/slot gets elongated from wear, like slamming it back in. The measurement is off unless you recalibrate and allow for it. Check this out.

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I won't lend him my tapes. Ever hear of using body parts measuring? Read about it long ago, think by a carpenter. He knew the exact length of his fingers, arms, joint to joint. Could get to within 1/16" for anything less up to about 8'. Helps if you ain't fat and have sharp bones. Recalibrate with age and shoe wear. I measured my middle finger to wrist, different fingers, middle finger to elbow, etc. Then when I next had to measure something I had forgotten those measurements, so I just grabbed a tape.

--Vic

Reply to
Vic Smith

On 3/3/2011 8:25 AM Vic Smith spake thus:

Fine, but how the *hell* am I supposed to get two metal squares to stay put, one of them upside-down at the top of the wall, plus juggle the tape measure between them? Upsidasium? Remember, this is a vertical measurement of wall height.

Reply to
David Nebenzahl

The claim that the holes and therefore measurement would deform 1/8", easily, is off base. Tape measures are made from tempered steel and the tape would tear before the deformation would get so large.

If there's a bit of deformation, just bend the tab to tweak the measurement reading until it is correct.

R
Reply to
RicodJour

I'm a plane guy, not a rule guy, and I have lots of Stanley stuff, but I never saw one of those Stanley extension rules before. Thanks for posting that.

R
Reply to
RicodJour

On 3/3/2011 10:18 AM chaniarts spake thus:

OK, I see; but it seems a whole lot simpler just to make ONE mark an arbitrary distance from floor or ceiling (say 12"), then measure from the mark to the opposite end. Why make two marks?

Reply to
David Nebenzahl

don't know. i'm not vic. i'd guess he's really saying to use a square to mark off 12" from the top, then use the same square from the bottom, then measure between the 2 marks. he just left off the use of making pencil marks, thinking that that may just be a little bit self evident.

i'd do it with 1 mark too since i can usually reach the floor with a tape.

Reply to
chaniarts

Never actually did that 2 mark deal. But if I wanted to get within 1/16" as David seems to want, that's how I'd do it. Last time I measured floor to ceiling I think I stood on a stool, jammed the tape casing against the ceiling, and lowered the tape until it touched the floor without bending, locked it down, then added the case size. Close enough.

--Vic

Reply to
Vic Smith

You are really out of the loop with pro tools these days. Go the to the Bosch tools site and look at the laser measuring things. The DLR165K is my favorite. One of the others may suit your needs better. Other manufacturers are in the fray, of course, so choices abound. If you like to spend money on upscale products, there is Leica and Hilti. Beware, though, if the device says 'XXX 1/6" that's exactly what it is. Cut accurately to that length and you have a press fit to struggle with. Doesn't mean you have to toss the folding rule. I still keep my antique Lufkin aluminum folding rule in my sewn in holster on the leg of my grubbies. (Don't know how else to describe that handy side pocket.) The lasers are absolutely vital if you are framing in for windows and doors. The diagonal measurements are spot on and when you set a new window in you can be sure that there will be an exact 1/4" (or whatever) gap all around. Same applies for closet framing, other interior framing. The power of the diagonal measurement and a level cannot be underestimated.

Joe

Reply to
Joe

In news:4d6f28a7$0$14579$ snipped-for-privacy@news.adtechcomputers.com, David Nebenzahl typed: :: Alright, so this is Carpentry 101, but I'm gonna ask it :: anyhow. :: :: Question concerns taking measurements where there is an :: inside corner: how do you do it accurately? F'rinstance, :: say you're sheeting the inside of a closet and are :: measuring the wall height from floor to ceiling. You put :: the bottom of your tape against the floor, climb up on :: your stepstool or whatever, then wrap your tape around the :: top corner of the wall. What then? :: :: I mean, it's really hard to know just what exactly the :: actual height is. It *looks* like 93 5/8--no, make that :: 11/16--maybe 3/4--WTF? :: :: It almost makes me want to build myself a little "story :: pole", two long sticks grooved together with a little :: clamp to take exact inside measurements. (I think a :: sliding dovetail would work nicely here.) :: :: How do you handle this? How did carpenters do this in the :: olden days? What tricks do you use? How many times do you :: just cut a piece oversize, then trim to fit? :: :: :: -- :: The phrase "jump the shark" itself jumped the shark about :: a decade ago. :: :: - Usenet

Doesn't your tape have a movable end-piece for inside/outside measurements, and on the body it should say "Add xx inches". Put the tape to the inside edges, lock it, pull it down, look at the length, add whatever is required for the tape body, and done. 've never seen a tape measure without that kind of feature; if yours doesn't have it, buy one that does.

Reply to
Twayne

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