2 knob or 3? wiring?

ultimately i doesnt matter what anyone posts here..........

like my first post said call your local agents and ask i have a home with K&T can you sell me homeowners insurance......??

the big issues are home inspector hassles, and insurance hassles.

incidently some K&T was found on a holmes on homes show. the inspect rebuild house show.

mike holmes said unsafe and it was all ripped out.

even if mike was wrong and the K&T perfectly safe and effective people looking to buy a home will likely pass on any home for sale with K&T.....

since 90% of homebuyers demand a move in ready house with no repairs needed, just having K&T has reduced your shoppers by 90%

note many here like me would be happy to buy a fixer upperbut we are a small select group that doesnt reflect most home buyers nationwide..

Reply to
bob haller
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So require all older homes be demolished.

Reply to
bud--

in the last 70 to 100 years how many vehicles have you purchased?

now compare that cost to new wiring........

wiring is way cheaper than a new car:)

Reply to
bob haller

On 7/9/2011 3:04 PM, bob haller wrote: ...

...

Most portions of all of which are also _far_ too stringent adding way more cost than any possible benefit...

--

Reply to
dpb

How many moving, wearing parts are in an average car? How many moving, wearing parts are in an insulated copper conductor? Totally moronic analogy

Reply to
RBM

Yeah, i was kind of wondering about that analogy. One is a machine that wears out and the other is a house. Some people are still using word perfect on dos 3.2 machines. If it still writes a letter for you.....

The guy is never gonna admit he's a dick and wrong.

Reply to
Steve Barker

what losses can a malfunction of a vehicle or homes electrical system risk? both can cause accident or death

over the years both vehicles and homes electrical systems have experienced significant safety upgrades.

the big difference between a vehicle and your home?????/

vehicles depreciate and become far less valuable over time.

homes usually increase over time and are the biggest investment most people make in a lifetime

Reply to
bob haller

Really!

Reply to
RBM

well up till the current economic dump homes over time always went up in value.

the crash of home values in the US is unprecendented

Reply to
bob haller

just think this topic will be coming up again soon..... so we can do this all over again.....

Reply to
bob haller

bob haller posted for all of us...

Yeah, he was commenting on the "repairs" to the K&T Also this is Canada.

Also snip your posts...

Reply to
Tekkie®

I wonder what percentage of ALL K&T still in use today has never been modified? I bet near all has been modified over the years.

Reply to
bob haller

Just consult your Ouija board like you have in the past.

"Modified"? Probably not many systems that have not been added to with other wiring.

And K&T is still in the NEC. One of the permitted uses is "extensions of existing installations".

Reply to
bud--

Well modern electrical systems can have every electrical connection checked by opening a workbox or fixture:)

With K&T there are no boxes to open, open a wall for another reason sometimes you discover a overheated burned electrical connection buried in the wall. where it could easily start a fire.,

Reply to
bob haller

Instead of pulling this nonsense out of your ass, show some documentation, pictures, etc. of all these "burned electrical connections" from K&T.

Reply to
RBM

Obviously you havent been around K&T.

Connections were made in walls, with no access after the plaster walls went up.

This introduced 2 HAZARDS........

a connection could overheat and being inaccessible it cant be seen or inspected

the connection may be around something that can burn, like insulation, wood etc....

K&T was a good system when installed, but its aged now.

Reply to
bob haller

pictures, etc. you can find to back up your statements.

>
Reply to
RBM

Geez Roy - what kind of electrician are you that hasn't been around K&T???

I have "been around K&T". I have run across one bad concealed connection. I don't remember any "hacked" K&T. Maybe it is a Pennsylvania thing.

There has to be documentation of all the probably thousands of fires caused by all haller's bad K&T, but haller has a problem with documentation.

Like his link to a report from the "Pennsylvania Department of Community and Economic Development" that says "properly installed and unaltered K&T wiring is not an inherent fire hazard", from an agency that does not "replace K&T at every opportunity", and insulates over K&T. And in haller's own state.

And his link that said "the wires in knob-and-tube are aluminum" which is a problem because copper and aluminum "carry current at slightly different speeds" and "copper into aluminum is where things get tricky - if the water (current) flows faster thru copper than thru aluminum, you are going to get a backup at that junction."

haller does, however, have a very active Ouija board from which he gets a lot of his information. Would a video of the Ouija board in action be OK Roy?

Reply to
bud--

My personal belief is that Haller lives on a street with dilapidated old houses where nobody has the funds to upgrade or do proper repairs. In his narrow view of the world, he sees all houses like those around him. Despite the fact that you've pointed out to him 9000 times that K&T is still recognized in the newest NEC,HE CAN'T HEAR YOU.

Yes, as an electrician since 1972, and second generation as well, I've seen K&T a time or two. What interested me most about the stuff, from the first time I came across it, was the very fact that it holds up so much better than many types of wiring that came later. That, and the fact that it was so labor intensive to install,and really was a work of art. In today's world with grounded systems and the labor involved , K&T isn't practical to install, but I've never seen any reason to leave the few outlets connected to it for a lamp or two, which isn't to say that new, additional circuits shouldn't be run to facilitate new equipment. And by the way Bud, how old is your car???

Reply to
RBM

That is because every time someone mentions K&T wiring you go off on a religious rant and if anyone dares to disagree it gores your sacred ox and you rant all the more. How about we all chant three times "K&T wiring is evidence of the devils influence in this world and a brazen manifestation of evil." Will that satisfy your religious fervor on this issue.

I will confess here and now that I am one of the devils agents. I have installed K&T wiring in the last twenty years. The fact that it was an historic building and that it was installed with money from a preservation grant will never assuage a true believer but that is OK with me.

-- Tom Horne

Reply to
Tom Horne

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