1950s Chest Freezer Refurbish

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Elevators in our condo were update last year with a feature that uses gravity to automatically return them to the bottom floor if the power fails. No emergency power required.
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The Streets wrote:

Yeah, but how fast does it go down?
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HeyBub wrote:

Uh - how fast does it have to go down?
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Hmmm. I thought most buildings already had that -- at least for basic systems like exit and power-failure lights. One of the lessons learned in the first Wold Trade Center bombing was that a central emergency system generator, if destroyed -- which it was, can't do any good when the power failures. The WTC replaced stairway lights with local battery-power units which did work on 9/11.
I see battery-powered egress lights in restaurants, churches, stores, etc. now. Something for elevators sounds a bit more expensive especially for tall buildings, but even a system that returns the elevator cab to the main floor could be powered by something like a car battery for the bit of power and limited time required.
TKM
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Something for elevators sounds a bit more expensive especially for

yeah thats all thats needed........
just enough to get all elevators down and doors open.
so firefighters can do other more important things
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snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

NO!!!
There was an a outage, the cause of which is still undetermined.
"Two nuclear reactors at Florida Power & Light's Turkey Point station in South Florida shut down Tuesday afternoon, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission said.
It is unclear if the loss of power caused the outage or if the outage caused the reactors to trip. "Turkey Point temporarily lost off-site power, and both reactors tripped," said NRC spokesman Roger Hannah.
The cause of the outages remains unclear, Tampa Electric spokeswoman Laura Duda told the newspaper.
She described a "significant disturbance" on the state's electric grid. It could have been a transmission problem, or a large electricity generating unit unexpectedly going off line, or another problem altogether. "We are working with other utilities to figure out what the problem was," she said."
Whatever it was, it was purely operational, not safety-related.
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YES!!!!!!!!!
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snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

What would that have been and how do you know?
The root cause of the event is still undetermined.
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Incorrect.
A switch failed causing a huge "ripple" in the grid, which in turn caused the nuke plants to react defensively by shutting down to avoid being overstressed by the sudden imbalance. IOW, they shut down for "safety reasons".
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snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

That is operational design trip, not a safety system-induced trip. There's a difference between the two.
--

--

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Please feel free to continue with your fantasy. I won't bother attempting to wake you from your dream.
See Ya
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snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

No fantasy at all -- having spent 30 years in reactor design and utility operations, I know the difference between safety and non-safety system--I designed them.
--
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MAYBE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
--
Christopher A. Young
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I heard that on the radio. All those poor Floridians, burning furniture to stay warm, as the temperatures drop below 80.
--
Christopher A. Young
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On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 16:14:32 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"

The "safety issue" was that the distribution system had a failure. They shut down the power plant because they had nothing to do with the power it was making.
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Dr. Hardcrab wrote:

...
Actually, in the end it was a very good test and demonstration of the adequacy of the system design to handle a LOCA (albeit an operator-error induced one, but a LOCA nonetheless).
--
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dpb wrote:

Probably ought to clarify that a bit--the LOCA (loss of coolant accident) part wasn't actually an operator error; it occurred when the PORVs (pilot-operated relief valves) did not automatically reseat after they opened.
The problem occurred on the operator response to the incident wherein they interceded w/ the HPI (High pressure injection) systems and later the RCPs (reactor coolant pumps) on the basis of their misinterpretation of the pressurizer level instrumentation indication and the fact they did not recognize they had a leak (stuck PORV).
This came about because the PORV location was close enough to the pressurizer outlet that the liquid-water interface became comingled owing to the flow disturbance. This confused the level indication which was a dP cell across the interface.
Consequently, they erroneously concluded that somehow they were in danger of filling the pressurizer solid w/ water which is a no-no, hence they turned off the HPI to avoid (they thought) doing that. Then, after a while as they continued to lose cooling water, the RCPs began to cavitate and they were turned off to prevent damage to them. At that point they then had a core becoming uncovered and no longer had forced circulation of what coolant they did have and things went downhill from there.
As I noted previously, the shift which came on next recognized the symptoms when they were going through the shift turnover meetings and began recovery operations immediately.
As a very brief synopsis, this leaves out a lot of detail, of course, but is a general description of what went wrong at TMI. There are a couple of obvious things here, the most obvious of which was the question of how, if the system were in danger of going solid, could there have been such low coolant level as to have caused RCP cavitation?
What went right, of course, was that HPI was incorporated in the system and once it was restarted to cover the core and the RCPS were again on to circulate flow, the accident was on its way towards mitigation.
Of course, the sad part is that if the operators had simply left the system alone, there would have been nothing but an operational incident of the stuck PORV (for which there was already a pending corrective action/notice in place) and after a short outage to repair/correct it, the plant would have been back in operation.
--
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TMI-2 was virtually a non-accident: A small volume of irradiated steam was released to the atmosphere. There was no injury to any thing or any one.
It's all about timing, folks...
March 16, 1979 - The China Syndrome starring Hanoi Jane and Jack Lemmon opens in theaters.
March 28, 1979 - Three Mile Island Unit 2 incident
April 26, 1986 - Chernobyl #4 disaster
"Slightly" different containment philosophy, too. U.S. reactors are housed in containment structures consisting of 3-4-foot-thick, steel reinforced concrete able to withstand the direct impact of a Boeing 727.
The Soviet Union's idea of containment at Chernobyl (and others to this day) is the equivalent of a metal-sided pole shed.
TMI-2 "belched" some bad steam.
Chernobyl-4 exploded, melted-down and killed virtually everyone that worked on the subsequent job of encasing the core in concrete. The direct fallout "nuked" a nearby, evacuated city. It is still abandoned but barely "hot". *Normal* wildlife and flora flourish there and have for years.
Kudos to George W. Bush to be the first President since the 1970s to have the guts to actually call for more nukes. We can (and should) build more nuke plants.
--
:)
JR

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could of been much worse if cooling hadnt been restored..... there was concern of a explosion in the containment too

not strong enough for larger planes espically with a full load of fuel in use today and they have been used as weapons:(

yeah like the spent fuel storage rods in cooling pools nationwide. perfect terrorists targets........

have you looked at the zone of exclusion, far more than one city its a entire region where humans cant safely live for probably a thousand years


theres lots of wildlife, but those animals suffer from tumors cancer and early death. true humans arent around to bother them. animals move into the thousands of abandoned but still standing buildings

Well good old bush isnt exactly known for being a intelligent president, his legacy is one of failure. his approval rate under 30% the vast majority dont trust his judgement
for the pro nuke plant people...........
long term can you guarantee safe storage of spent fuel till its harmless?' how about short term storage in pools near reactors?
imagine a plane laden with explosives being flown into a storage pool.
how would the nuke power industry pay for long term thousand year storage?
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