12 cu ft frost free fridge not cooling properly

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On Wednesday, July 16, 2014 10:48:54 PM UTC-4, nestork wrote:

Your free to satisfy your curiosity, but I don't see anything probative to be gained by seeing the coils. You know the compressor is running continuously, the internal fan is running and air is coming out. You can feel or measure the temperature of the air coming out.
I don't think it's physically possible for that condition to exist, without something being wrong with the refrigeration system and the coils not getting cold. The only possible way might be for the defrost heater to be stuck on, but you have access to it's wiring and could disable it. If anyone has seen a fridge with the conditions you have, where the coils were actually getting cold, I'd like to hear what it was.......
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On 7/17/2014 9:33 AM, trader_4 wrote:

Based on the symptoms reported, I concur. Sure seems a shame to scrap an otherwise good refrig because it needs a couple ounces of refrigerant.
If the tire on your car was soft, would you remove and discard the tire, rim, valve stem, etc?
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On Thursday, July 17, 2014 9:46:24 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:

The problems are that if it does need refigerant, then:
A - there must be a leak somewhere that needs to be investigated/fixed
B - Unless you have the skills, tools, supplies to do A, the cost of A, or just getting a service guy in the door isn't worth it when it's an old fridge and the OP says a replacement one costs $400 new.

Of course not. But the cost of getting a leaking tire fixed is what? $20? You can also diagnose it, fix it yourself for a few bucks. You can't do that with the refrigerant portion of a fridge.
Also factor in that a new refrigerator typically uses half the energy that a 25 year old one does, which could save $75 - $100 a year, and the choice becomes obvious.
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On 7/17/2014 10:28 AM, trader_4 wrote:

CY: Unless law changed, units having less than 50 pounds refrigerant don't need to be repaired.

CY: That's maybe true for Canada, but I work a bit cheaper in NY.

CY: As a result of government over regulation.

CY: Who says his refrig is that old?
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On Thursday, July 17, 2014 10:35:46 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:

So, it doesn't have to be at least investigated? You just pump in more refrigerant without determining what may be leaking, the size of the leak? If you did that, put in some, charged $150 and then 2 weeks later the fridge isn't working and the customer wants their money back, then what?

IDK what you charge in NY, but like others here, it's typically min $100 to get an appliance service guy out. And that's before any charges for adding refrigerant, etc.

You're right, he hasn't said how old it is, I'm just guessing the age. Even if it's just a few years old though, if a new one is just $400, given the *mimimun* possible problem, the cost of a service call to find out for sure what's wrong, etc, the economics here say to junk it. The one thing that might change that would be if it's still under warranty. Even then, if just the compressor is under warranty, not the whole thing, it's probably still not worth it.
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On 7/17/2014 11:45 AM, trader_4 wrote:

CY: Advise customer before filling, no way to know how long it will last.

CY: Thanks, that's good to know.

CY: Now, that opens an idea. If the Nestork unit is less than 5 years old, might be on warranty.
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On 7/17/2014 12:45 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Many are now only 1 year on the sealed system. Times have changed.
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On 7/17/2014 7:57 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> system. Times have changed.
Didn't know that. Yes, that's a change.
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On Wed, 16 Jul 2014 21:52:38 -0400, Stormin Mormon

Local HVAC shop is $120 to walk through the door.
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On 7/17/2014 6:11 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Sounds a bit higher than myself. Maybe I'm out of touch with the modern era, or some thing?
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In my area appliance repair folks charge $100 just to walk in the front door and tell you it is broken. The actual repair and parts are extra. At that cost most people just buy a new appliance which now a days seem to last no more than 5 years.
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On 7/17/2014 7:45 AM, Steve Stone wrote:

I do remember a couple years ago, I looked at a friend's upright freezer. The last repair guy put a thermometer in it and told em to "keep an eye on it". I found it low on refrigerant, and juiced it up for them.
What a shame, appliances don't last very long.
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Well, after a full two days of operating continuously, the plastic cup of water in the freezer compartment still isn't frozen.
I'll start on taking the freezer floor and styrofoam evaporator cover off this evening (hopefully). Then I'll wait for any remaining frost on the evaporator to melt and plug the fridge back in. I'm expecting to see a half frosted evaporator coil...
.. but life is full of surprises.
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On 7/17/2014 8:36 AM, nestork wrote:

From your descrip so far, I'd dare to guess 1/4 frosted evaporator.
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The fridges were all bought in July of 2000, so I expect the warranty on the sealed system would have expired by now.
But, I'll ask just to be sure.
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On 7/17/2014 10:32 PM, nestork wrote:

The owners manuals I've read over the years, typically five years warranty on "sealed system".
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On 7/18/2014 6:31 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

No longer on most.
From the $2000 Frigidaire manual Your appliance is covered by a one year limited warranty. For one year from your original date of purchase, Electrolux will pay all costs for repairing or replacing any parts of this appliance that prove to be defective in materials or workmanship when such appliance is installed, used and maintained in accordance with the provided instructions.
Maybe if you spent more, say a $3000 Whirpool. Nope.
For one year from the date of purchase, when this major appliance is operated and maintained according to instructions attached to or furnished with the product, Whirlpool Corporation or Whirlpool Canada LP (hereafter “Whirlpool”) will pay for Factory Specified Parts and repair labor to correct defects in materials or workmanship that existed when this major appliance was purchased. Service must be provided by a Whirlpool designated service company. YOUR SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE REMEDY UNDER THIS LIMITED WARRANTY SHALL BE PRODUCT REPAIR AS PROVIDED HEREIN. This limited warranty is valid only in the United States or Canada and applies only when the major appliance is used in the country in which it was purchased. Proof of original purchase date is required to obtain service under this limited warranty.
But wait, you have them Krazy Koreans LG is not so bad 1 Year Parts and Labor, 7 Years on the Sealed System, 10 Years on Linear Compressor
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Well, this is what my evaporator looks like after about 48 hours of continuous operation with no defrost cycles. I skipped over the defrost cycles by manually advancing the defrost timer on the fridge.
http://users.usinternet.com/nkelebay/Solder/Fridge-2.jpg
The evaporator coil has a total of 40 loops; 20 in the front half and 20 in the rear half. There's frost formed on the first 7 coils, and the rest are bare.
Me thinks it's time for a new fridge.
--
nestork

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On 7/19/2014 3:51 PM, nestork wrote:

That's pretty conclusive low refrigerant. I'm sad to see a refrig scrapped, "only" because of low charge.
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You're 99% sure of being correct. Only question, any sign of an oily leak, where the freon and oil mixture may have leaked out? Or, it could be just a very weak compressor, either way, scope out the weekend ads for bargains.
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