Waterfurnace Problems

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536cfm for a 3-6 ton system??? Who & How measured? Was the system sized to heat or cool the 4100 sf? Sounds like an airflow issue. What's the temp drop/rise across the coil? What's the pressure drop across the coil? Clean filter? You should have around 400 cfm/ton as a rule...
Now the wet questions: GPM? GPM? GPM? GPM? GPM? GPM? Temps & pressures drop across the coaxial tube heat exchanger? (I'm sure those pete's plugs were installed on the inlet & outlet... Gauges, even better)
Closed loop, open loop, pond loop system? Vertical or horizontal loops? loop depths & spacing? How many holes did you dig & how much tube is in the ground?
Was/is the loop installer IGSPHA trained or certified, or even know what IGSPHA is/does/stands for?
www.waterfurnace.com/pdfs/products/SP1575.pdf Here's the link for your unit specs (first link found on a google search) It shows the units low speed air flow should be 1400 cfm & the high speed should be 2200 I presume you have the proper airhandler & coil built for this system, if so, reduct the entire system because a 14" round ain't gonna cut it. Waterfurnace suggests/requires a variable speed unit with the 072 as well, and those are dependant on the static pressure of the duct...
It sounds like it's never hitting 2nd stage, which would cause the constant operation at high & low outdoor temps. If the 30dF is your design low temp, I'd question geo over airsource in the first place.
good luck geothermaljones st.paul. mn

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wrote:

The 536 cfm is duct leakage from a flow hood test , I had done. I have a closed vertical with 2000 ft. total loop. The Intellizone is set at 1850 max cfm's as the installor claimed to the inspectors. The air handler is not listed as a matching unit, a York 5 ton which the installor changed the motor two a 1 hp? I have had a lot of questions which he acts like I'm a nut, Why did'nt you install air handler which is recommended. Why is the line set differant than listed in the manual. Why is my hot water heater 75 feet from the unit. And why don't my system work right. Our installor has installed hundreds of these units. Waterfurance is all he installs. Thanks,RT
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Like I said the installer was a hack, 100% crap for an installer.
No wonder WaterFurnace doesn't care about your problem, its not a matched system approaved by ARI. You have a six ton unit with a five ton condenser, 14 " duct that can serve only a 2.5 ton AC. THEN he puts in a 1HP fan motor which does nothing but run up the electric bill.
Sorry Kjpro, but 14" round duct for a six ton unit doesn't work. As to the loop, forget about it at this moment, your duct system, its design, the mismatched equipment all spells tearing up all the walls in the home to correct this system. To do it correctly will cost almost double after you consider the cost of fixing up your home after they tear out the inside walls to gain access, the cleaning of it, and THEN it probably wont work correctly when this is done.
BTW, if a few of these hackers end up in court just MAYBE we can keep them out of the trade. I'm sick of hack jobs, I see them and quote against them just about every day...

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Whao, I didn't say that it was adequite (or that it'd work). All I stated was that with the information posted, it was a little hash to state "get a lawyer" with your first post. Then ask questions about the install. Get the facts first.
I just think before stating "get a lawyer" that we make sure we have proof in the pudding. By stating "get a lawyer" from the gate does nothing but stir up the OP and raise their BP.

Same here, I'm sick of the everyday messes... but unfortunately it's not going to change overnight.
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My BP has been raised for a year. The unit is under our master bedroom and I get up about 3am to turn off the breakers. It runs and runs. My dealers problem is that I ask questions. I work for a world wide company myself, factory rep. in mining. I go by the book. When I looked at the manuals, I started asking questions. I don't want to sue, but I've been and paying for test. And at the end of the day we want it to work. But it's hard to find people that takes pride in there work anymore. I hate hacks too!!
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Post where you live, there may be someone here that can assist, of course it won't be free, but most here really know the trade.
BTW, what type of mining, or company? I have RIG and GMR, both doing well but always looking for a better play :-)

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LOL, I didn't see this post, I made another one in response to your other previous post.
There I stated that I re-read my post and it seemed aggressive and wasn't meant to be, just have a lot going on right now with family etc.
Also, I agree with you concerning this post. I have forgotten the first rule on this forum, Homeowners usually want everything free, and secondly, they usually get things wrong. Sounds like this guy however isn't a typical groaner, I bet Paul would disagree LOL !!!
Once again, sorry about the attitude that seemed to be expressed to you.

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rule
No problem, we all like to jump to conclusions every once in a while. :-)
But, it's starting to sound like this guy is taking a ride on a hackmobile. :-(
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I call "Bunk"! The OP's story is just way too screwed up. I believe it was the same old thing. He picked the lowest bidder and got what he paid for. No way can a company that installs "hundreds" of them keep doing it that badly and not finally get hammered. Your story is screwed up and/or your system is most likely screwed up. Find another waterfurnace dealer have him come out with a rep and get it straightened out. Be prepared for lots of expensive repairs. Tear out and Re-do. It should be about double or triple of what you originally paid. Why do you think we love hacks so much. Bubba
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This OP's story is the way it is. Most don't know any better. I've had another waterfurnace dealer doing test. The installor must ask for a factory rep. I've been asking for a year, after two TXV's was replaced and 3 months later the compressor was replaced. I fill I've paided enought. I'm like you, how could he be a dealer for waterfurance. Since they went puplic, sells is all they care about. Or call waterfurance and ask for Bob Peck, ask him who installs the most units for him. Then you will know the rest of the story.. Regards, RT
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What the! Anybody notice the change in writing and grammar, this sounds like TURTLE here!! Maybe this is a Troll trap??? Then you say you replaced and PAID for two TXV's and a Compressor since Sept, which both are under warrnaty? I'm starting to believe your yanking our chains here.

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29% of the air is lost to duct leakage? Codes call for sealing & insulating in most states...
I agree, the air side is your problem. If Waterfurnace is all he installs, why is he Frankensteining a York unit w/swapped motor & incorrect line sizes. What reason would he have to switch a 5 ton blower to a 1 horse, unless he knew the duct was undersized.
When you hired the guy was this the system he bid to you? I'd like to see that proposal, do you have this in writing? Did you sign it?
Waterfurnace has no dog in this fight because their equipment can't be proven faulty until it's correctly installed. The inspectors may well be pests, but I'd hound them to keep on this guy, now & in the future.
I'd have the other Waterfurnace guy give you a bid for corrective procedures & get going on them. Anything but a Waterfurnace compatible variable speed air handler is unacceptable. The VS blower will save you $15-20.00 a month alone (over a typical 5Ton blower) If your using a desuperheater for a waterheater 75' away, I doubt that's saving much money either.
Everything in your house, except the most energy consuming thing, is energystar rated... It's up to you as to how you recoup the money spent, but I'd document everything.
Did this guy also install the loops? If he does this above ground I can imagine he's really creative with the stuff you can't see. I'd have the temps, pressures & flow rates tested before I finalized anything with this guy. I certainly hope the 2000' is 6-150' wells & not a single 1000' ft loop... I'd ask the well driller, or does this guy own his own drill rig too? The county water board probably has a pretty decent record of all wells drilled... at least they do in my area.
good luck geothermaljones st.paul. mn
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"Frankensteining a York unit"
I have to remember that one!! We've all have seen our portions of that description, and just as scary too LOL ---- Touch

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