Why 3k, the furnace costs about $1000, materials maybe $200 so you make $1300 for less than a days work. I just had one done for approx $2400 (not Goodman) including a 10 year warranty. Easy access (bsmt) and 2 x 20' 2" PVC. He said he normally charges $2900 but business was slow in the summer.
Roy, I get about 4K to install a variable speed 90, and 3.3K for a 80% vs furnace. I provide for 7 families including my own, with a good living wage, all benefits, 1-2 weeks vaca, outings and parties, bonus', etc. I also cover my overhead which is about $360K per year. My payroll is 7k per week.
1300 X 5 = 6500 doesn't even cover my payroll, much less my overhead, and hell, who needs a profit.But, hell you are one cheap son of a bitch to want to deny my workers enough money to feed their families and go on a vacation once a year.
I hope your guy has a good retirement plan, and has someone picked out to pick up where he left off. And.......what kind of idiot doesn't install AC in the summer.
Bob... it's the 'Wal-Mart' mentality... I believe.
But my comment was this: A guy that doesn't install AC in the summer is most likely someone who doesn't know how....
... and if he hasn't taken the time and effort to do that.. then I certainly wouldn't want him installing gas appliances in my home.
But that's just me...
Jake
$200 for materials????????????????? LOL
LP kit? Gas Piping Flu/Combustion Piping (priced PVC & fittings lately) Termination Kit (flu/combustion) Supply transition Return transition Sheet Metal Supplies Mastic Sealant (duct sealant) Media Filter Rack (with extra media) Condensate Pump? Drain Supplies New Digital Stat Electrical Wiring (priced copper wiring lately) Electrical Supplies Control Wiring and Supplies PVC Cleaner PVC Glue Pipe Sealant Hanger Materials Sheet Metal Screws Hanger Screws Vibration Mounts (Equipment Pad) Wire Ties Misc Supplies
So, what did he not provide you for that $200?
Then how much do you think a 1 Year Labor Warranty is worth?
Don't forget that he not only has to provide the materials needed, but he has to provide the following:
Service/Installation Vehicle Insurance for said vehicle Plates for said vehicle Vehicle Maintenance Liability Insurance Tools Tools and Equipment Insurance Tool Maintenance Technical Training New Product Training Code Books Business License Sales Tax License Certification Fees Uniforms Uniform Service Garbage Disposal
Ut-Oh
Don't forget............
Federal Taxes State Taxes County Taxes Social Security (not just the half you pay, he's self employed so he pays the whole amount) Property Taxes Sales Tax
Vacations
Store Front (mortgage/rent) Property/Renters Insurance Building Repairs Shop Furniture Shop Tools Dealer Meetings Advertising Inventory Inventory Taxes Business Equipment Business Forms Brochures Computers Software Postage Legal Fees CPA Fees Trade Subscriptions Office Staff Unemployment Insurance Workman's Comp Health Plans
Telephone Bill Electrical Bill Gas Bill Water Bill Sewer Bill Security Bill Mobile Telephone Bill Pager Bill
Health Insurance
401K Holiday Pay Sick Pay Life Insurance Dental/Vision InsuranceAre you still set on your $200 for the extras????????
If this doesn't open your eyes, nothing will!!!!
A very special kind, lol.
In Ca, a licensed Plumber (C-36) is allowed to do heating work, as back when the license laws were created, hydronic heating played a large part. Today, many licensed plumbing companies also do ac (illegally, unless they also carry a C-20 HVAC license). So its not uncommon to see drain cleaning companies also doing hvac work....
I hope they wash their hands first!
I understand and appreciate your overhead costs however:
There is a business term " Economies of scale" which does not seem to apply to your trade.
"When more units of a good or a service can be produced on a larger scale, yet with (on average) less input costs, economies of scale (ES) are said to be achieved. Alternatively, this means that as a company grows and production units increase, a company will have a better chance to decrease its costs. According to theory, economic growth may be achieved when economies of scale are realized."
BTW, my local mechanic charges approx $60/hr and has all those expenses and more (ie: $5000/mo lease) Why is it that he can make a living at $60 yet you guys need approx $300/hr???
And what do you deny your customers by charging them $300/hr when they probably make less than $25/hr?
This is a one-man shop, Overhead is about nil, If he installs 3 furnaces a month he is making a living wage. Add a few service calls and he's doing very well. Not bad for maybe 5 days work a month.
The kind of idiot who doesn't install AC is one who lives in an area where maybe 1 out of 1000 homes uses AC or HP's.
Who said anything about $300/hr???
Does your mechanic load that shop up in the back of his vehicle and work "on site" at your residence? Open up your mind and think, their is a lot of cost that you want to dismiss as legit costs of doing business.
If one charges less, their lifestyle and benefits are a direct reflection of that lower service rate. I on one hand like to be on top of my game. That cost money to support the latest equipment, training and resources to provide the best service for my clients that I possibly can provide.
That doesn't come cheap!
If that's true, he's charging to much for his services or he isn't running a shop with insurance and the required tools to operate a legit business!
Seems the average is 4k to install a +90% VS = $4000 - $1600 equipment cost = $2400 labor / 8 hrs = $300/hr
No, but he pays a lot to lease a shop.
I can see your point but not for a one-man shop specializing in installing and servicing furnaces.
Oh, so now it's magically a VS $1600 furnace. What happened to the $1000 furnace and $200 in materials?
8 hrs??? I can just imagine the steps that were skipped in your installation. I'd love to see pictures of this mess.Do we not have shops too???
If he "specializes in furnaces" he's not the cheapest in town.
Bob's post: "Roy, I get about 4K to install a variable speed 90, and 3.3K for a 80% vs furnace. I provide for 7 families including my own, with a good living wage, all benefits, 1-2 weeks vaca, outings and parties, bonus', etc. I also cover my overhead which is about $360K per year. My payroll is 7k per week."
As I said before I have had quotes over $5,000 for the same equipment, average is $4,000 NOT VS!
No, I had one quote for $2100 but the guy was unreliable
You stated above "As I said before I have had quotes over $5,000 for the same equipment, average is $4,000 NOT VS!"
Your guy was $2400. That's the bottom end for your area... it's time to wake up and smell the BULLSHIT.
In a prior post you claimed we made $1300 per day. Now it's $2400 per day.
There are 2 major differences between auto mechanics and what we do. First, the vehicle is brought to the mechanic. His labor efficiency is darned near 100%.
Second, every vehicle he works on has been made by a manufacturer and is virtually identical to every other vehicle that's the same model. We work on systems that are manufactured on site with wide variations in site and consumer needs.
Most auto sh>BTW, my local mechanic charges approx $60/hr and has all those expenses and
Roy, you can bullshit yourself all you want, but do try to get your facts and figures straight if you're going to try to bullshit us.
Figuring 8 hr days @ 5 days a week, your furnace guy has to work 1/2 of the month just to pay his monthly lease. Forget payroll for those two weeks. Now in your part of the world, maybe thats called making a living.
For the record, why dont you post your furnace installers total expenses for the month & total income for the month.
Until then, you're about as credible as the stormin moron. BTW, he's not your furnace guy is he?
I did smell the BS from the other overpriced contractors who would have done the install the same (or worse) as the CORRECTLY priced contractor I selected.
What lease? He operates from his house and passenger van.
Well since I'm not him I can't do that but I could estimate: Income:
3 installs at $2900 each $8700 15 service calls @ 150 ea $2250 Total $10950Expenses: Gas $200 Depreciation $200 (uses van for both personal and business) Tool replacement $100
3 furnaces $3000 Parts/supplies for 3 furnace installs $600 Parts for 15 service calls (50 x 15) $750 Total $4750Net income $6150
Not too shabby for maybe 8 days work a month
No load calculation.
No combustion testing.
No static pressure testing.
Do you have any pictures that you can upload of this install, I need to see this, it should be a real site!
Try $125-$150 a week. Let's add about another $100 a month for tires, repair, oil changes, etc.
A van is $25-$30k and good for maybe 5 years. That's $400-$500 a month.
Double that.
This is way low, but let's let it stand.
$1000 a month insurance $500 a month minimum rent $150 cell and land line $500 month advertising $500-$1000 month misc exp - uniforms, office equipment and supplies, postage
So the one man show makes, using your numbers, $3500 gross per month. Less the FICA & MC your employer pays that's just over $3200. Probably averages a minimum of 50 hours a week (60 or more if he's like most small business owners) and that's a whopping $16/hr. Or $20 if the lucky SOB only works 40 a week.
Now he might like to take a couple weeks vacation a year. Probably would like to get at least 5 holidays and might even be sick 5 days a year. So he nets: $3200 a month equals $800 a week. But he's only working 48 weeks so he grosses $38,400 a year or a real gross of about $740 a week. Less than $15 an hour at 50 hours a week. Plus no OT pay not to mention nothing other than SS for retirement.
Would you want the risks for this sort of benefit?
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.