If you'd do everything you suggested to the OP when you went on a
call like that, then you probably don't own a set of gauges. First
thing I'd do is check superheat and subcool, cause odds would be in
favor of the thing being low on refrigerant. Regardless of that, your
conclusions and methods were just plain incorrect. You're not only a
troll, by your own admission, but you're giving out incorrect advice
and that can be more than an irritation to any homeowner who
accidentally takes it seriously. Hvac systems can be deadly to the
Stormin - over there in the corner - will be smiling and thinking "oh
doody, me got a fwend".
You are the one attempting to troll, and poorly I would add.
All of my post was built for the Home Owner as a generic process to
carry out prior to making a call __IF the call is needed__.
You, like many Hacks, have a problem with that (advice). I find no
fault in that, merely laugh at your insecurity.
Making the statement "your conclusions and methods were just plain
incorrect" just does not cut it, Pal. You will have to put your finger
on exactly that which you believe is "incorrect advice". anything else
is just Bluster and Bullshit, of which there is Plenty in this NG.
FYI - there was a time when I myself was well able to use the six
senses and a clamp/tong meter to sort _any_ problem in the vapor
compression cycle for units under 20ton. For systems beyond that a
sling physchrometer and maybe an anemometer could be added for
It is known as "non invasive diagnostics". Practiced adeptly there is
no problem achieving a positive result for the client. You have yet to
get to that level of competence, I see :-]
You hang as much "crap"[sic] on my advice as you like, you will not
change the Facts nor the results for those who _choose_ to use it.
As an observation.
Thank pHuck you (and those like you who claim MD status) are _not_ a
practising clinician, otherwise we would _all_ be wearing Nappies from
the overly enthusiastic reaming of the ass in investigating _why_ we
had a headache.
And please do fix that POS you are using to post with. Not only is it
borking the thread, it is also attributing statements to my posting I
did not make.
I have fixed it this time, do it again and I _will_ kick your butt.
How many fans (I note you said "all") do you suppose the unit has? How
do you suppose the homeowner is going to check for correct speed? How
do you suppose the speed of the fans might relate to a starved
Your statment was so immaterial to the problem that it doesn't deserve
further discussion. Unless the condenser fan motor simply wasn't
running, fan speed isn't a concern in this case.
Also immaterial based upon the observed symptoms. A reduction in
indoor air volume would tend to cause oversaturation of a coil that
has fixed metering, and no major change to superheat in a TXV system,
although the outlet of the coil would experience a drop in
temperature, and thus presumable a greater tendency to condense
moisture. Another strawman, but let's continue to explore your idiocy.
Same as above.
Why change the blower speed? If it was adjusted correctly at start-up,
then changing it will adversely affect performance, and alter what
would otherwise be normal readings for the system.
Differential readings don't require calibration of the thermometer
readings. Unneccesary corrections are a waste of the homeowners time.
Have any citations to support that sentiment? ASHRAE, white papers,
manufacture's data, etc.?
The only rule of thumb is that most people have two of them. deltaT
can vary wildly depending upon indoor and outdoor conditions, and
especially upon the design of the system itself.
If the system has fixed metering, and is a little low on refrigerant,
then blocking indoor air flow will serve only to reduce superheat and
saturated temp, i.e. actually cause even sweating, which is quite the
opposite of your claim. Bristol actaully recommends checking
superheat under that condition (blower motor disabled), but given the
low saturated temp that this causes, the outlet of the evap will be
below freezing, and thus presumably below dewpoint, even with 5-15 deg
superheat. I'll let you calculate how high the superheat must be under
this condition before the outlet ceases to be below dewpoint. If you
don't derive a substantial refrigeration problem, then I think enough
has been said.
To clear it of what? What the hell are you blocking the flow for
anyway, when you can just disable the blower motor?
Always a good idea, for a tech who knows what he's doing, but the
average homeowner usually doesn't even know that a dirty condenser is
And why should they look for oil stains, are they going to repair the
leak themselves? If it's leaking, they'll know something is wrong
soon enough. Let the tech do the leak searching.
Something obvious, same advice.
The more info the better. I let the customer tell me everthing and
anything that they've noticed. Always a good practice. MD's even
insist upon it with their patients.
The readings you suggested won't mean a thing to the homeowner, in
fact they won't mean much to even the experienced tech unless the
readings are way out of range.
I think you've proven how much of a professional you are. The question
is "professional what"?
at just what help one can generate for oneself, given the motivation
and a _little_ direction.
I say "you would be amazed" as obviously you have never had to help
yourself. When the day comes you will remember this thread... and
to place a DD. With an amount down as Good Faith we can then continue
with lessons on a contract or piecework, your choice.
I may be retired but I will not work for free.
IF you are one of those who think the aged should willingly grant
whippersnappers the benefit of their accumulated knowledge (in detail)
then think again. You do the yards the same way I had to, Young Fella.
for the apprentices. Does not wash here and impresses nobody, that
Truth is very obvious.
All of my original response was generic advice, as a process. Grant
the OP and other readers enough Brain Space to adapt what fits to
their own specific purpose.
Hint. Has nothing to do with building clones of your Mom.
between what he feels and what he reads. DeltaT cannot be calculated
when the readings are not the readings at the point of testing. The
whole process (self help) relies on persons being astute in that which
they <see-hear-feel>. Alcohol thermometers are renown for their
inaccuracy. Calibrated Hg would not be justified as a cost, in this
Again to the OP. Calibrate whatever you buy.
them. You will not get me doing your work. Least, not until you get a
for the apprentices. Does not wash here and impresses nobody, that
Truth is very obvious.
You wish for the OP to now start disconnecting wiring/drives or
whatever on your say so. Have you that medic ticket/licence at the
grey area. See you can help, if forced :-D.
someone with self-help skills has.
SH'r: "Hellooo, Acme Hacks"
AH: "Yus Sir"
SH'r: " My <insert Make/model here> has a huge oil stain on the pan
and around this pipe that has maybe 30 other small pipes coming from
it, you think gas could get out from there?"
AH: "Why certainly, Sir"
SH'r:: "How much to fix something like that?"
AH: "$1200, Sir"
SH'r:: "Thank you"
/looking around for crackers
Struth, you are plain out of Luck. Starve :-p
Buddies here going to get it through your thick skulls that split HVAC
is _not _ Rocket Science. In fact the whole of VC as a working medium
is far from overly technical in the bigger scope of technical
Medicos are a different kettle of fish to the guy who fronts your door
waving his "gauges" at you. Just for starters it is a very sure bet
the guy has had no more diagnostic training than what he has managed
to develop himself, depending on his exposure. Reading this NG I would
offer it is a fair bet that training amounts to Zilch. Therefore I
stay with what I originally offered. The OP can decide for themselves,
if need be.. or circumstance change.
County. A high degree of self important arrogance, perhaps?
snip the sophomoric histrionics
It is noted you are still having trouble with that POS you use.
There is a brand (as in branding steers) given to Google Gropers. Your
posting is living testament to the worthiness of such disdain. I do
put up with the garbage as I know you know no better. It is very
obvious you have even less a grip on NNTP matters than you do about
the field you wish to debate (HVAC).
Prep school is over. Graduate to something that works or take your sad
and sorry ass away from this thread. Again, I fixed your post - no
^^_Another? When was the first time? I didn't address the
^^_points in your previous reply simply because my first
^^_reply to it still stands. Your advice was totally
^^_meaningless to homeowners, and most of it was
^^_just plain wrong.
My last post....
I find it it very interesting there seem to be so many frustrated
people adding to this forum. Why are you even answering at all? If
you are so fed up with answering what you think are stupid questions,
don't answer. One day you will need someone elses advice, auto
mechanic, Lawyer, Dr. I don't care. I only hope they respond to you
in the same professional and curteous manner.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out
similar Summer Design to SW WI?
Is the upstairs level 4,000 to 8,000-sq.ft., how high are the ceilings
in the rooms? Was a Manual J performed to indicate the heat-gain?
WISDOM PRINCIPLE DIRECTED EMPOWERMENT COMMUNICATIONS -
THE REAL POLITICAL ISSUES and WISDOM BASED PEOPLE EMPOWERMENT
HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.