The curse of BER

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Actually I was supporting Farml in my own demented way. I read treads and comment on the tread with a few exceptions and think of rec.gardens as USENET NOT A GROUP.
--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
What use one more wake up call?
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wrote in message

Tire treads?
Paul
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Which end is pointed at the water?
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
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wrote in message

Enough horses certainly tried to lead him to the connection between BER and watering.
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Bill who putters wrote:

You can bring a horticulture but you cannot make her think.
David
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The only conspiracy here is in your head.
We are here to talk about gardening. So why would you ask a question and then ignore all the people who told you about BER and inconsistent watering?
The rest of us aren't here for your convenience. If you want advice then put some effort into thinking about the responses you're given. If you are going to tell us a whole heap of different stories about your watering habits, if you are not going to take advice that is kindly given, then don't be at all surprised when someone gets sick of your idiocy and yanks your choker chain to try to bring you to heel.
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Paul M. Cook wrote:

Reaching into the cruel and obscure corner of the insult bag now.
David
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Now David, be careful, god protects drunks and fools.
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
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wrote:

And doesn't give a rats ass about their victims. If it made sense, they wouldn't call it faith.
Paul
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Go big or go home. Take no prisoners. This is war, damn it not a game of cricket.
Paul
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Paul M. Cook wrote:

Just as well because Fran has a really mean bouncer.
D
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Paul M. Cook wrote:

You can overdose because dolomite will raise the pH, so it would be good to know the pH before you start. For tomatoes you are looking for pH about 6 to 6.5 IIRC. I would try about half a cup. It isn't very soluble so it will take a while to work.
David
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David Hare-Scott said:

Gypsum will add calcium without shifting the pH.
--
Pat in Plymouth MI

"Vegetables are like bombs packed tight with all kinds of important
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Warning!!! - Dolomite can be very nasty stuff to handle. Use a respirator mask! Not some simple dust mask! Dolomite can burn your soil (and your lungs) if too much is applied. I suggest a non burning form of agricultural lime. There are some forms of lime that are pelletized and much much safer (mask may OR may not be needed) and easier to use.
However, I have never heard of anyone using dolomite for pots. Like the person stated above, just use some calcium tables.
--
Enjoy Life... Dan

Garden in Zone 5 South East Michigan.
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<http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId 23883>
--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
What use one more wake up call?
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Dan L. wrote:

I don't know where you get that information from, but I've used dolomite limestone (ground up marble) since I was on the farm 65 years ago. We got it by the dump truck load and used broadcast spreaders to put it on the fields and nobody every had mask or gloves. Since moving to smaller property some 40 years ago, I've been buying it by the 100, then 50 & now 40 pound bag because that's the way it was/is sold. What I get in the bags is pelletized, but what we got by the truck load was not.

I agree, I have never tried to grow anything but flowers in pots!! My regular tomato vines are caged 6 foot high & the grape tomatoes are hanging over a 6 foot high wall. They wouldn't last an hour in a pot.
Tom J
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MSDS Dolomite
<https://sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId 23883>
Section 11: Toxicological Information Routes of Entry: Inhalation. Ingestion. Toxicity to Animals: LD50: Not available. LC50: Not available. Chronic Effects on Humans: Not available. Other Toxic Effects on Humans: Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant), of ingestion, of inhalation. Special Remarks on Toxicity to Animals: Not available. Special Remarks on Chronic Effects on Humans: Not available. Special Remarks on other Toxic Effects on Humans: Acute Potential Health Effects: Skin: May cause skin irritation. Eyes: Dust can cause eye irritation. Inhalation: This material is a dust or may produce dust. It may cause respiratory tract irritation. Breathing in small amounts of this material during normal industrial handling is not likely to cause harmful effects. Breathing in large amounts may be harmful. Ingestion: May cause digestive tract irritation. Swallowing small amounts during normal industrial handling is not likely to cause harmful effects. Swallowing large amounts may be harmful. Symptoms of exposure to this material through inhalation or ingestion may include: mouth and throat irritation, scratchy feeling, and coughing.

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/contain/msg1222441932013.html For the 5:1:1 mix only: 1 level tbsp of dolomitic (garden) lime per gallon of soil or 1/2 cup per cubic foot. Don't worry about gypsum or Epsom salts unless you decide to try the gritty mix.
More than I'll ever want to know about container gardening: <http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/contain/msg0212444023053.html
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
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Dan L. wrote:

I had always considered dolomite to be one iof the fairly benign agricultural minerals and the possibility of it doing personal harm is new to me.
Dolomite is calcium magnesium carbonate. It is slightly soluble and mildly alkaline in water, very much like agricultural lime. It is often used in place of lime to raise pH and/or to add magnesium if the soil is deficient. It can contain impurities of heavy metals but so can gypsum and other agricultural minerals, the risk with these is cumulative build-up rather than immediate damage.
What do you mean by "it can burn your lungs"? What damage would it do?
What do you mean by "burn your soil"? What would happen? How is it different to "non burning agricultural lime" (which is calcium carbonate) other than the presence of magnesium as well as calcium? How does the magnesium make it dangerous?
If you are not in a position to supply details yourself please give a reference to this information.
David
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First, I will state DOLOMITE is a very good product for gardening and farm use! I am saying, use personal protection like the labels on the bags state. I use and will continue to use dolomite.
I dropped a bag once and the dust flew. I was coughing so hard my lungs was so sore and had a burning feeling for a week before I could breath right. I had chest xrays and medicine to help the irritant clear up. I did have safety googles on that protected my eyes. However, I had no respirator, I used a cheap dust mask, that mistake will not happen again. It may not kill or do permanent damage. However, I would not take that warning label on the bag too lightly. Those bags of dolomite that I have purchased, all have a warning label that states "USE A RESPIRATOR WHEN USING THIS PRODUCT".
David, have ever used Dolomite? David, have you ever not read the warning labels on those bags?
Burn your soil - like in have you not ever put too much fertilizer on your grass? It turned the grass brown like it was BURNED and it took weeks for the grass to grow back again.
Agricultural Lime is mostly pure calcium carbonate. Depending on the soil test that extra magnesium may not be needed or wanted. I stand corrected about the statement I made -> "non burning agricultural lime" that statement may not be completely true.
There are some forms of pelleted limes that may not burn. Example "NUTRALIME" a commercial product name. http://www.mineralprocess.com/Lawn-Turf/nutralime.html Unknown if it is better that other forms of limes, however I never need a mask with it and I could use a cheap spreader.
Do I need to repeat the web sites the Bill and Billy has posted? Ok. http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId 23883 Read section 8, on personal safety for dolomite. States to use safety goggles and a respirator.
--
Enjoy Life... Dan

Garden in Zone 5 South East Michigan.
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Dan L. wrote:

There are a great many substances in this world (including lime) that are harmless in most circumstances that will do you harm if finely divided and breathed in.

Yes, I see no difference to lime, which was my point. I don't wear a mask when using either. Nor do I throw it about and inhale the cloud.

Yes, everything has warnings on the bag. This shows that we live in a litigious age not that everything is seriously harmful. I am amazed that it doesn't warn "may contain peanuts".

I have seen this happen though not been personally responsible. Applying lime or dolomite does not have the risk of causing this problem because they are so chemically different to the soluble salts that make up synthetic fertiliser or the compounds found in (say) fresh chicken manure. This is not to say you cannot overdose lime or dolomite but the consequences and the speed of onset of the problem would be quite different.

Pelletised products may be less irritating if thrown about. In some circumstances finely ground lime is preferred because it spreads better and dissolves (and so acts) faster. For example the local limestone quarry has a course grade for industrial use and a fine grade for agricultural.

No need to repeat it, it looks to me about the same as lime, that is 'slightly hazardous'. I wasn't saying that it is harmless but that you were exaggerating the likelihood of injury from occasional use. If I was spreading tons of either lime or dolomite behind the tractor I would be wearing the full protective gear but that is not adding a spoon of it to a pot plant.
David
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