rotating plants--do you?

[DigitalVinyl]

I've read a lot about rotaing crops/plants and for me it isn't terribly practical. Tomatoes & peppers cover most of my area so rotating really can't be done. I only have one large size container without peppers(7 plants) or tomatoes(3 plants) so unless I grow my garden considerably rotation really isn't possible. (I've kept it small and maintainable) And next year I'm looking to add more hot peppers and a cherry tomato.

I seem to recall reading a note from one person that said tomatoes could be in the same place year after year without issue. However several problems affect tomatoes, peppers, eggplant and even potatoes, so unless you have a lot of space dedicated to NOT those four I don't see how small gardeners can rotate.

I recognized this before I started and one thing I did to maybe compensate was a lot of interplanting. Lettuce, spinach, radishes, carrots, onions, garlic, peas, half-dozen herbs & flowers were all planted in the same beds as T&P. Whether that helps to keep specific bacteria and disease from building up in the soil... i dunno. Hopefully I will move before I find out.

DiGiTAL ViNYL (no email) Zone 6b/7, Westchester Co, NY, 1 mile off L.I.Sound

1st Year Gardener

[animaux]

Well, rotation is to be sure not to promote disease. Tomatoes and peppers are both solanacea family. I grow those in containers also, but only because I bring them into the greenhouse in winter and keep the harvest till at least January or February.

If you start to have diseases pop up, you'll know it and you will then have to solarize to kill the pathogen or rotate.

[Frogleg]

Rotation is mainly used to reduce disease transmission. If your plants are OK this year, there's not much reason to have to rotate for the next. Home gardeners grow the same things in the same places for years. If you *do* have a disease problem, it would be wise to not plant the same thing in the same place.

[DigitalVinyl]

Well, one of my containers was hit by what I believe was Vermicilium Wilt. I've steadily nursed the plant but the wilt continues to steadily defoliate it--It is nearly naked except for top growth. I've harvested 12 tomatoes (slighlty smaller than expected) and another 12 one the way. I'm going to grow brocolli and some small interplantings there next year.

My potato plant also had characteristic V-shape yellowing on leaves and one branch completely defoliated. This looked like VW as well.

In my large patch of ground I one tomato bush is convered with black intervenial patches. I've never ID'd what this is. I guess maybe some kinda blight. Don't know if this should be rotated--which would a shame. Perfect spot.

has steadily progressed from the bottom up and covers just about the entire five and a half foot plant. However it didn't seem to hurt production. I've harvested 4 dozen 1/4lb plums and I've got a dozen or more still growing.

DiGiTAL ViNYL (no email) Zone 6b/7, Westchester Co, NY, 1 mile off L.I.Sound

1st Year Gardener

[Cereoid-UR12-]

Wouldn't it be wonderful to put them all on a giant "Lazy Susan" so you can have fun rotating them all day long? HeHe!

It is best not to grow a particular crop in the same plant family in the same spot the next year so that insect pests and diseases don't get established.

[Cereoid-UR12-]

The person was speaking hypothetically and did not specify the size of the growing area, you obsessive fusspot.

Most mature insects are attracted by the scent of the plants (not their location) to lay their eggs. However, the larvae will emerge from the pupae in the same location they overwinter.

[DigitalVinyl]

Well actually I wasn't speaking hypothetically and I did mention the size ("I've kept it small and maintainable") and I did mention I only had one large container that did not contain a pepper/tomato family. Common sense would not lead many to believe I had a vast garden, unless I was a commercial tomato/pepper farmer and...would I even be here asking such a question?

I would think that due to Solanaceae's popularity many people would have issues rotaing properly for the home gardeners. I've read you should skip a plot for two years, which means Solanaceae can only account for 1/3 of your space. If I had to expand the garden to 3x the size of my tomatoes, peppers, potatoes & eggplant--it would be considerable.

I also question the "wisdom" of plots next to eachother. If soil overwinters bacteria and insects, being right next to last year's sq.ft. of tomatoes seems just as bad as being in the same plot. We all till and rake the soil around-not to mention what earthworms are spreading. Like Frogleg, I wonder if being 15' away is really going to make a difference come next spring for insects. I was actually going to post a similar conclusion the other day.

DiGiTAL ViNYL (no email) Zone 6b/7, Westchester Co, NY, 1 mile off L.I.Sound

1st Year Gardener

[Frogleg]

^_^ Of all the epithets hurled at newsgroup posters, I find "obsessive fusspot" both literate and appropriate. Being correctly described, I must point out that the OP *did* specify the size of his garden plot, and rhat I'd also viewed photos of his garden situation. He wasn't speaking hypothetically, but of actual conditions in his garden.

How would *you* like to be called a cantankerous and knowledgable teddybear, Cereoid? :-)

[Cereoid-UR12-]

Glorioski!

I have been called cantankerous, knowledgeable and a teddybear, but not necessarily all at the same time and not while rotating plants!!

[simy1]

As frogleg has pointed out, rotation is mostly for disease prevention. Here in Michigan my tomatoes are virtually free of disease (big, big difference from Georgia) and they could be planted in the same place every year. I am guessing coastal NY is more disease prone, milder winters and wetter growing seasons. One of my neighbours even has a spot along a fence where cherry tomatoes and lettuce come up year after year. She only weeds out the weeds every spring.

Coupled to rotation, what you do with your plants in the fall is also part of the equation. You should either toss them or hotcompost them, but that is not what I do. Sometimes I put them on the lawn and mow them, sometimes I put them under the raspberries, and sometimes I put them on top of my smaller beds where greens are grown, and greens are totally immune to disease in this corner of the world.

This said, I have my tomatoes on a 3-year rotation, which I will probably cut down to two starting next year because in the third year I have them over three beds and that is too messy for my taste. I could have a much longer rotation but my beds are oriented N-S and I prefer to use only the back of the beds for the toms.

There is also the issue that different veggies deplete the soil at different rates for different nutrients. Rotation helps even out the load on your beds. Cabbage certainly sucks a lot of N out of the soil, and tomatoes probably a whole lot of K.

In your case you have no choice, so keep doing what you have, make sure you throw away the plants in the fall, and give them generous amounts of manure.

[DigitalVinyl]

I interplanted a decent amount (peppers, lettuces, radishes, carrots, parsley, thyme, onion, garlic plus six types of annual flowers) so I'm hoping to get a mix of "depletions" into this one soil bed. But nothing was the size of these tomato vines.

If I convert the grassy slope I may move one or two of the tomatoes there instead. See if I can replicate the success I had here.

I already purchased composted manure and humus to mix in for the winter. I wasn't sure what plants to till into the ground. I've got annuals, tomatoes, carrots, parsely, chives, peppers still growing in that plot. One tomato plant has something wrong with it,

the one next to it is growing straight through the sicker one's cage. But whatever is wrong with it hasn't hurt it's production (48 toms/12 lbs)

DiGiTAL ViNYL (no email) Zone 6b/7, Westchester Co, NY, 1 mile off L.I.Sound

1st Year Gardener