Plant a Garden, Get a Tax Break?

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This old-time union maid and hardcore lefty hasn't been mistaken for rightwinger in forty years! A new low for perceptivity, gal! But it fits in with all your perceptions. Attending to only half the facts is why you have to admit irrational capital-lettered rage, rather than an comprehending state of mind.
-paghat the ratgirl
--
visit my temperate gardening website:
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Methinks it is perhaps other than syndromic. Most things are overdetermined.
Oi, Vai... but whadda I know, I'm yoost a liar, eh?
Charlie
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Quoting Bingo the Philosopher Dog now, are ya'?
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Investigate! Agitate! Aggravate! Advocate! Educate! Propagate!
Charlie
"Washing one's hands of the conflict between the powerful and the powerless means to side with the powerful, not to be neutral." ~~Paulo Freire
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On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 16:46:10 -0500, Charlie wrote:

Watergate.
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I like the idea of "to bring out".
Here is some Indian philosophy trying to make sense.
http://www.sssbpt.info/ssspeaks/volume34/sss34-20.pdf
Indian philosophy too much for this western guy. Prefer Chinese and Thomas Merton attempts to figure what it is all about.
Bill a student of some human constructs who just started to bring over my Dad's compost and is waiting for son's to show up as it is a task. May be this it it?
--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

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Thanks. I'll attempt to muddle thru this, though the opening poem struck me well.

Thomas Merton. I've read a little but have not yet bought any book. Funny you mention him. I have one picture of him I use as wall paper sometimes. I can't describe his countenance adequately. You can see for yourself
http://michaelkrahn.com/blog/thomas-merton /

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Meant to add. This is an important point. This idea of culture and it's relationship to our spiritual journey.
Scott Peck states (paraphrase) that one cannot, without great difficulty, or possibly not at all, advance spiritually outside of their culture and upbringing and their cultures religious beliefs. After years of struggle, I realize this as truth, to me. How can one relate completely to a philosophy that is grounded in millenia of culture and society, and it's language with it's inherent symbolism, that is alien to the student? One cannot truly understand a language, or worse, a translation, or the ideas and symbolism, apart from the culture.
I have come to believe that how we philosophically/spiritually learn is dependant upon our cultural understanding, and we add in philosophy and ideas and beliefs of others that benefit our journey. Ideas and beliefs with which we were innoculated as children, and as societal/cultural members, are very powerful. Thus my oft repeated statement of having to *unlearn* many things. It is quite easy to say that we reject or modify early teaching, yet sometimes quite difficult to actually arrive at that place.
ahh.....confusing....yes.
Confused Charlie
"If I am walking with two other men, each of them will serve as my teacher. I will pick out the good points of the one and imitate them, and the bad points of the other and correct them in myself." ~~Confucius
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Charlie, Charlie, that reminds me,
A woman was talking to her friend "over the fence" when she noticed her husband coming home carrying a bunch of flowers.
Her friend said "Isn't that nice, he's bringing you flowers."
The woman said "Great - that means another weekend flat on my back with my feet up in the air!"
The friend said "What's the matter, don't you have a vase?"
--

Billy

The Death of Rachel Corrie
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LOL
And this is why I imitate your good points.
Ihre Schler Charlie
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As a man was relieving himself in front of a statue of the Buddha, a priest yelled at him, and scolded him for relieving himself in front of the Buddha. The man responded,"Where isn't the Buddha?"
Maybe, even in a gardening newsgroup.
--

Billy

The Murder of Rachel Corrie
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On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 23:03:32 -0500, Charlie wrote:

This is not always true. I suppose my parents were very good for me in this regard because whatever religious "thing" I wanted to attend was okay by them. When I was 8 years old I went to Young Judia (sp?) and when I was staying at my grandmother's house we went to the RC Church and I knew the mass. There weren't problems of forced religion so I didn't carry any of the dogmatic baggage when I was old enough to start a spiritual journey.
After several failed attempts at different pagan systems, I found Tibetan Buddhism. Everything about it seemed familiar, even the cultural aspects. It's my contention that, since the US is such a young country, and people are taking rebirth all the time, many people being born here are possibly from other eastern cultures in past lives.
Some of the most unlikely people have become yogini's. My sister in law who attended 12 years of Catholic school is a yogini and has taken vows of chastity and devotes herself to her Swami. She's also an advanced yoga instructor. In ten million years I never would have thought she was drawn to a Hindu based spiritual path.
So, I think less and less people are being born into this baggage of their parents. It would seem the world is changing, though very slowly. I think much of the world is going to be destroyed before it comes back up from the depths of spiritual bankruptcy. I also think non-theistic religions like Buddhism are going to take more of a hold in the west because it truly is an intense study or science of the mind and its operation through mind training.
I have a lot of hope. Maybe I'm wrong.
V
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wrote:

Hmmm...yes, this could explain, in part, the differences and difficulties in people's ability to fit in a belief system that is outside their culture. Interesting. Incarnation, reincarntion...this perhaps bears a little more integrated thought upon my part. Don't take this a cue to proselytize. ;-) (joke, that's a joke, note smileyface thingie!!! No disrespect intended!!)

The paths to the mountaintop are varied, are they not? Apologies to dis-interested parties for seemingly going off topic, but then again, should not gardening be a spiritual journey, a realization of the interconnectedness and interdependency of all, cycles of birth and death?
Central to most major belief systems, theist or otherwise, are the principles of duty to others and self-sacrifice, which, to me, implies negation of Self. Self is the issue. If we seek Duty, it is nothing, it is Self seeking fulfilment. If we can remove Self (damned hard), situations *will* present themselves that allow duty to be fulfilled. I believe this is at the heart of many "religions", but is not understood by many, at least in the West. The principle below, common to all, should indicate what path we should follow.
Buddhism: Hurt not others in ways that you yourself would find hurtful.: Udana Varga 5:18
Christianity: All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.: Matthew 7:12
Islam: No one of you is a believer until he desires for his brother what which he desires for himself. Sunnah
Judaism: What is hateful to you, do not to your fellowmen. That is the entire Law; all the rest is commentary.: Talmud, Shabbat 31:a
Confucianism: Surely it is the maxim of loving-kindness: Do not unto others that you would not have them do unto you.: Analects 15:23
Taoism: Regard your neighbor's gain as your own gain, and your neighbor's loss as your own loss.: T'ai Shag Kan Ying P'ien
Pardon my musings. We each make our own way, taking what we may from whatever instruction benefits us. The journey, the holy intent and attempt, is what I find to be most important. And finding interesting traveling companions along the way, in whatever circumstance I find my Self.
Who knows. Are you duty presenting itself to me? Am I to you? :-)
Now, I must go rest a bit before lunchtime duty begins. I've a cold and feel like shit. Probably caught it as punishment for straying from the path and engaging unkindly with that person the last couple days. ;-) ;-)
Later Charlie
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Oh alright, Methuselah. Back to gardening.
Charlie
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On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 10:29:05 -0500, Charlie wrote:

None taken. Reincarnation is not what happens to lay Buddhist in general. We take a rebirth. A reincarnation implies it is the same mind stream in its conscious state throughout the process of death and into the next life. For example, the Dalai Lama is the reincarnation of Chenrezig as said in Tibetan, and Avalokiteshvara in Sanskrit. He is the reincarnation of the Buddha of Compassion. He has seen emptiness and knows and abides in the perfection of wisdom. Me, I am just a shlep slogging through, practicing and practicing. Practice makes perfect.

Yes, you just described emptiness. Nothing exists from its own side. It is dependant on a label, and that label is what determines what it is. Each of us have perceptions and not always in agreement. There are certain things I can't grasp; ie: how do we all agree something is green and collectively we see a color and label it green. This is where it gets confusing to me. So I study and go to teachings.

Not negation of self, emptiness of self. If you like me and someone doesn't like me, I am still appearing to those different labels as something, right? I exist, but I'm empty and depend on interconnection of millions and billions of things which have to happen in order for me to take a good human rebirth.
I'm going to hear a six day teaching by His Holiness the Dalai Lama in Pennsylvania in July. He will be teaching on the Great Treatise as presented by Lama Tsongkhapa, at the request of Master Atisha five hundred years after the historical Buddha Shakyamuni had already gone into his current position, the Buddha field where the perfection of wisdom resides. The teaching is also refered to as the Lamrim, or in English, Stages of the Path. It's all very fascinating to me and I feel comfortable surrounding myself.

Musings pardoned. Muse away. This is the stuff anyway and yes I do believe gardening is a path which could lead us to our spiritual life. No doubt about it.
As for presenting one to the other, we've both empty and dependent on a label, so duty away!
You didn't get the cold for the reason you implied, you got the cold as a result of something you did in another life and that karma is ripening as a cold. My karma ripened as liver disease. I rejoice for its ripening, one less hell realm.
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On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 02:54:31 -0500, Charlie wrote:

Since its been stable since the beginning of rec.gardens, based on my observations, this is a very angry person with a serious infection of self.
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Victoria said in her typical angriness & habit of projecting. So be careful of that crappy-ass self-hating temper of yours. The one long period when I stopped ignoring your periodic bids for a flame war with me you didn't come off all that tidy with your own pretences & fibberies throughout your nutso posting history, and changing your handle every couple years doesn't make your long history of craziness disappear. These last couple years, whether from pity or compassion, I've been kind to you even when you have your "moods" & you know it. If you don't want to reciprocate I'm always up for our previous relationship.
-paghat the ratgirl
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On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 08:26:26 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@paghat.com (paghat) wrote:

You are good for a laugh. I'll give you that. Change is good. Stagnate in your paghat "handle" if you will. I change periodically.
You never ignored me. White knuckle, maybe. I wouldn't have anyone like you as a friend. You only have time for you.
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Aha! Always suspected it. You do it for the attention too. Only, alas, you have to imagine you're gettin' it even during long period when you're not

I offered mutual tolerance, not friendship. Although I'm not above offering friendship to a nutter, I just didn't happen to in your case. So you jump the gun refusing it.

If I had your mental & physical medical conditions I'd project that on to others too. I know you've got a tough life, it's why I take periodic pity & forgive some of your behaviors. I mean, crap, I had pain in my arm and became self-absorbed until it was gone. I can't imagine being in medical crisis pretty much ever minute of borrowed time.
-paggers
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On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 10:05:04 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@paghat.com (paghat) wrote:

Wrong again.

I never refused anything, I professed it.

You'd be crawled up in a ball if you had my situation, which you are calling medical crisis (which is only the way YOU see it dear). On the other hand, I flourish and bounce back time and time again. I am not in any sort of a tough life. I have money, a wonderful husband/best friend, a parrot I adore, a beautiful home with a fifty foot pool, hot tub and sauna, plenty of room to garden, and my health is karma. I rejoice its ripening. I don't need any of it to be happy. Security is not what I have, it]s what I can do without. You know nothing about me. Stick to what you know...all about you.
If you think you can't die before me, think again. Are you ready? My being medically limited doesn't give you a longer life. Best to be ready.
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