Is a Big Hunk of Steak Worth Almost 2,000 Gallons of Water?

[Omelet]

"Correlation does not equal Causation".

[Zootal]

Unfortunately, to all too many people, it does :(

How about "figures don't lie, but liars can sure figure"?

Problem with that is that it implies intent, and minimizes stupidity when in fact stupidity far exceeds ill intent.

[enigma]

"Zootal" wrote in news:e6idnVP5_voLZAzVnZ2dnUVZ [e-mail]:

i was vegetarian for 20-someodd years, not because i think eating animals is wrong, but because eating meat made me sick. i managed to get through a meat cutting class in college while vegetarian with no problems. i now eat limited quantities of meats, but only grass-fed or "organically" raised types. commercial meat, like from the grocery store, still makes me sick. my guess is it's something in the feed.

horse is good. kinda sweetish. llamas are pretty smart as well & when i suggested i was going to cull one of mine & eat it, i thought i was going to be hunted down & lynched by the 'llamas are cute pasture pets' people! what an uproar over an animal.

especially because he wasn't being very observant. cattle & chickens, when free ranging, are both omnivores. lee

[Zootal]

Understandable. And respectable :)

I would think horse would be a bit tough, but maybe it depends on how much exercise they get. Hmm, never tried llama, never even though of eating one. I've met a few, and thought they were rather pissy, kinda like camels. I would not turn up my nose at a llama steak. I do, however, draw the line at insects. For some reason, the thought of eating bugs is very unappetizing, though I'm not sure why.

[Bill]

My favorite omnivore is the common Rat. Challenging to shoot them.

Bill

[Billy]

I must have jumped the tracks back there. You were talking about an "out of service" brown paper bag. Weren't you? Damn testosterone ;O)

That's when I started using post-its ;o)

[Billy]

Dan, you start with an opinion and presume it right, give a couple of lame analogies in support and then proclaim yourself victor?

Why don't we see large groups of societies of strict carnivores that has existed for hundreds?

This brings up the discussion of clever and smart. Humanity was very clever in designing a bomb that could destroy the world but, that wasn't very smart, was it.

What other animal has brought the planet to the abyss of destruction? We are good at conceptual thinking. That is our only edge but there are other forms of intelligence. Some animals know when to head for high ground before a tsunami. Others know the shortest distance to bring down a prey or how to migrate by following the constellations or magnetic fields.

[Billy]

[Dan L.]

Hmmm... You seem to be agreeing to some of the presuppositions.

True statement above. However, that statement does not mean the presuppositions and the relations are false. It is a theory that can be tested for the truth. It may be that there is a relation between animals that eat a wider variety of food and smarter animals DOES mean the variety of food caused the smartness.

Enjoy Life ... Dan

[Dan L.]

Are you taking the term "equal" as in being "bi-directional"? If so I am not sure that form of logic applies to the reasoning of past statements. I believe they are in the area of the Associative form of reasoning.

Enjoy Life ... Dan

[Dan L.]

It amazes me how people fall into these cute little sayings and assume that they are true statements.

Like: "figures don't lie, but liars can sure figure"? Many figures do tell the truth.

"Lies, damned lies, and statistics". Many statistics do tell the truth.

"He sure stirred up a horns nest here" Hmmm ... thats one of my favorite sayings.

I am sure you can provide more of these cute little sayings. Insults are good also, they work just as well as sayings.

However, no one here has showed absolute proof that those theories are wrong. those theories are not mine, it was presented in Michael Pollan's book Omnivore's Dilemma". I do believe they are true.

Enjoy Life ... Dan

[Dan L.]

Wrong analogy here Billy, you can do better than this :)

Many humans also know when to head for high ground before a tsunami (run). Many humans also know the shortest distance to bring down a prey (radar gun). Many humans also know to NAVIGATE by following the constellations (sextant) or magnetic fields (compass).

Are those really intelligence or physical skills. After all a lowly insect can kill a human. I would not necessarily call insects intelligent.

Intelligent people did design the bomb and it did end the war. No one has yet destroyed the world. Science as the saying goes "A double edge sword". Inventions can be used for good and evil. Intelligent people can kill sometimes for a good reason or for an evil reason. "Might makes right" ... Did I just quote a another stupid saying :)

Again - Cows are stupid compared to humans (on average). Remember - I did say on average :)

I know how you think Billy... so here are your answers. My Definitions. GOOD person - One that benefits the tribe in which they live within. EVIL person - One that harms the tribe in which they live within.

Stirring up a hornets nest is time consuming, I need sleep ... Dan

[Zootal]

Statistics and figures tell neither truth nor falsehood. Statistical methods describe data, and we make inferences about the data. But the data, the results of applied statistics, the figures, tell neither truth nor falsehood. We evaluate them, we consider them, we interpret them, we draw conclusions based on them. In the end, we decide if there is truth, falsehood, none of the above, not enough information, etc.

I prefer cute little sayings - they are more polite and convey more information :-)

If there was absolute proof one way or another, it would no longer be a theory. And absolute proof to one person is fantasy to another. People used to believe the world was flat, but belief never made something true or false. There will never be absolute proof of this, only opinions.

[Billy]

"Correlation does not "bi-directional" Causation".

I gotta tell you Dan, I've lost all interest in your vegetarians vs. carnivores, vis-a-vis omnivores, theory. The teeth in my head tell me to mostly eat vegetables and a little meat. It seems that most people of the world eat like that because raising meat commercially costs a lot of consumable calories. If I had to guess, I would presume that we would be better off eating all plants instead of all meat. But I really don't care what you think anymore.

[Omelet]

You mean like amongst many Politicians?

Poly = many Tics = blood sucking insects...

[Omelet]

I'm well aware that chickens will eat insects in preference to grain, (mine also loved it when I found a rats nest with pinks in it and tossed the pinks to them to eat)...

But COWS???

Cows eating meat is very much news to me?

[Omelet]

I hear ya there! In my past, I've eaten turtle, rattlesnake, porcupine, bear and squirrel. I will turn my nose up at Possum simply because I've rehabbed them and know how full of parasites they are.

Someone would have to pay me a LOT of money to choke down an insect. :-P

[Omelet]

Been there, done that!

[Omelet]

[Omelet]

Score one for Billy. :-) Yes, Brewers Yeast is one source of vitamin B-12 and it's in a separate kingdom. Neither plant nor animal.

Fungi are a delightfully low carb, high fiber source of a lot of unique nutrition.

I've been studying Stammet's books from FungiPerfecti.com and now do my best to include mushrooms as a regular part of our diets. I also happen to like them.

I was looking for a good food source for vitamin D other than expensive salmon, or fish oil. Fish oil does not agree much with me. :-P

Dried shitake's are VERY high in D without being high in A. I keep those on hand as they are inexpensive at the asian market and rehydrated, they do will in recipes.

I took some of the dried caps and broke them up, then powdered them in the blender. Shitake powder is a very tasty food additive...