HELP...grass seeding

I'm have 1/2 acre lot which has mostly clay spread over it that was dug out from the basement when the house was built. In some areas the construction machinery packed the clay very hard for about 1-2 inches on the top. This weekend I had 2-3inches of aged cow manure spread over the top and tilled in as much as possible. The hard areas would not till as it was too hard.
I want to seed grass but I was told that the manure is too rich (I don't know how to tell) and that it will burn the grass. What can I do to loosen up that top clay? Will manure do that? What do I need to do before I seed grass? How old does the manure have to be so it's not too rich?
Thanks, Peter
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Peter wrote:

I bought a few bags of composted cow manure from Meijer. My area is much smaller, I just poked holes with a pitchfork to aerate before spreading the compost. I seeded on top of this. The seeds sprouted fine and are growing nicely despite our sometimes chilly weather this fall. This is in an area with existing grass, I hand-pulled most of the weeds first.
Janine
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Peter wrote:

If the manure still stinks, it's too rich. If it has no objectionable odor, it's ok.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
It doesn't stink that bad at all and it's fluffy. Very easy to spread with a rake. Does that mean that I can seed right in it? Even if I don't have much dirt tilled into it? Like I said before I have at least 3" of manure on top of the clay.
Peter

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Worms -- lots and lots o' worms -- organic material, and time. :)
There are a few different species of worms that will work well for you, including the good ole fashioned nightcrawler. Red wigglers (eisenia fetida) will be good for the upper 12 inches or so and breaking organic material down. The other worms will work their way down and carry good soil with them, plus their tunnels aerate of course. With attention and lots of organic material, you can transform a good chunk of the clay (pardon the pun) into good soil.
As for seeding your grass, give the manure some time to settle in before seeding and it will be fine. You can add topsoil and till as well. (For that matter, I'd start raiding the neighbors leaf bags on trash day -- lots of good organic material in there and it will do wonders for your soil.)
One question comes to mind -- did you basically just spread the manure over clay or was their some measure of topsoil there?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
The intention was to spread the manure over existing dirt/clay and then till it all together. I'm no expert but the land had wild grass and weeds growing on it before I started the project. It all went south once the machinery packed the top layer too hard (approx 50% of the area) so the tiller could not mix the manure with the dirt anymore. Even when the tiller managed to break some test areas the chunks are very hard. Will I have any luck breaking up the hard shell in the spring once the ground is more moist of will watering help?
Do you figure I will have any luck if I seed in the spring on the manure?

soil
of
lots
over
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

till
growing
To develop and maintain a healthy lawn, you need a seed bed of at least 6 inches of loose, rich soil. If a rototiller cannot break through the compacted clay, new grass roots certainly cannot. I'd spread as much aged compost/manure as you can manage - 6-8 inches - leave it overwinter and then till it into the clay in spring. Between the activity of the worms and other soil organisms overwinter and rainfall, you should be able to till it in well next spring.
pam - gardengal
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
I agree with Pam. I had a very heavy clay patch to rototill once. I was able to chop up about 2 inches of the clay on each pass, with passes being a couple of weeks apart. Eventually I loosened it deep enough to plant.

could
to
of
then
other
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

till
growing
So there's good soil beneath the clay? That bites -- what commercial contractor digs out a basement but doesn't haul off the excavated materials? Bummer Hmmmmm....
How deep is the clay layer that was placed over top of the soil? Any idea how deep the soil below the clay might be?
I'm tellin ya -- the best thing you can do is buy a BUNCH of worms and just spread them over the area. Eisenia Fetida (http://www.happydranch.com ) needs 50ish degree weather to do its thing but if you get them down now they should do a good bit of work before it gets too cold and they'll likely overwinter fine (not sure where you're at). Earthworms/nightcrawlers will dig down well and there's one worm in particular that goes down to around 12 feet. As they dig through the soil and the clay, they'll take nutrients along with them and help convert the clay to good soil the old fashioned way.
You also need to mulch up leaves and grass to spread over the area for composting. Now is a perfect time as everyone is throwing their leaves away -- a pickup truck on trash day is a good way to go. I know it sounds crazy but you'll get all sorts of good organic material this way. You can hit your neighbors up and ask them to save the leaves for you as well -- makes it easier and ensure no mix of trash with the leaves. You can buy a leaf mulcher for around $100, mulch the leaves up, and spread them about. The worms will love that as well.
If you do this and keep it up, maybe add some more compost and/or top soil next year, working it into the existing, then you will not have to worry about tilling the clay.

It should be fairly well broken down by then but I doubt it will be quite enough. Just how deep IS the doo-doo? (Sorry, couldn't resist. :-P ) Grass will need about 6 inches or so to do well.
BTW, the following came over the CrazyGardeners1 Yahoo group recently -- since it may have value for your situation, I thought I'd cross-post it for your edification.
*************************************************************** Yuuupppp! Green manure is a great way of building topsoil when all you have is clay, sand, or other nasty soil. The most basic of all green manure rotations is BOP-BOP-RYE, which is Buckwheat Oats and Peas, followed by Buckwheat Oats and Peas, followed by winter rye. The buckwheat adds TONS of organice matter to the soil, the peas add nitrogen, and the oats gives structure. The winter rye holds the soil in place and also gives excellent structure to the soil due to its rather tough stems. But there are better choices once you have started investigating, and are willing to work out what your particular soil needs.
Red mammoth clover, for instance, not only gives tons of organic matter, but nitrogen as well, and sudan grass can not only give organic matter, but feeds the beneficial bacteria and fungi as it repells and kills bad nematodes. Daikon radish is GREAT for digging in deep and when tilled in will rot and creat an ideal spongy mass underground for sandy or clay soils. Organic matter right where you need it...Down deep. Alfalfa is also great at digging deep into the soil where you need it, fixing nitrogen farther down than clover, and loosening clay and binding sand. There are even cover crops for shade, subterranean clover, daikon radish, peas, vetch, Lotus uliginous (Mako lotus) is excellent for shade, but hard to find.
I like to simply mow the crops just as they begin to flower, and then seed the new crop right into the fresh chopped matter, to leave the roots and the beneficial fungi and bacteria web alone so it can spread effectively. Another thing you can do is to use the green manure crops as forage for your rabbits, goats, horses, cows...whatever, and let them add to the organic matter with their droppings. I actually plant a couple of hills on my property with browse cover crops for the deer, so they will give me the droppings and STAY THE HECK AWAY FROM MY HOSTAS! So far it works. Even the woodchuck would rather eat the nice fresh oats and barley than invade the garden. ***************************************************************
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.