Growing plants in a hole.

In very dry areas, is it possible to bore a 2-meter hole and plant a tree at the bottom?
The roots are nearer water this way and the hole will collect any scarce rainwater.
The tree will etiolate upwards into the light where normal growth will continue.
What do you think?
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On 10/11/12 3:43 PM, Peter Jason wrote:

If there is a rare heavy rain or if the surrounding land drains towards or near the hole, the tree will drown. I know of a group of Japanese ornamental cherry trees, some of which were planted in shallow basins. They are dying from root-rot.
Plant your tree on a slight mound.
If you can bore a hole 2 m deep, make 4-6 of them about 8 cm in diameter in a circle around where you want to plant your tree. Get 2 m lengths of 8 cm plastic pipe, the kind used for drains. Starting about 10 cm from one end, drill 2 cm holes around each pipe. Place each pipe in a hole in the ground with the undrilled 10 cm at the top. Fit a grate over each exposed pipe end to prevent the pipe from filling with leaves and other debris. Use these pipes to irrigate your tree by filling each pipe with water once a week.
If the water table is 2 m down, eventually the tree's roots should reach it. After 3-4 years, reduce the frequency of irrigating. If the tree does not show any stress, the roots have indeed found the water table. You might then be able to stop all irrigation. Leave the pipes; they will permit air to enter the soil, which is good for healthy trees.
Note that all this will not work only if the tree is a type that has only shallow roots that cannot reach the water table. Oaks, conifers, and many others develop tap roots that will succeed in finding the water table. But many of these are sensitive to excess water that would fill a 2 m planting hole.
--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean, see
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On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 21:15:02 -0700, "David E.

Thanks, do you mean that the circle of 8cm boreholes are there for watering, and to attract the roots of the tree downwards to a depth these might not reach normally? And that the roots therefore will be 2 meters further down in the earth than they normally be?
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On 10/12/12 4:53 PM, Peter Jason wrote:

The circle of holes are indeed for watering. The plastic pipe prevents the holes from collapsing and conducts the water all the way to the bottom.
Tree roots often grow quite deep, much more than 2 m. In deep, good soil, even tomato roots can reach down 3 m.
Yes, there are shallow-rooted trees such as those in the genus Populus (e.g., aspen, cottonwood, poplar). But these are normally planted only where others will not thrive because of climate or shallow soils.
Conifers and oaks generally have taproots that go quite deep in search of water.
--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean, see
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He is saying it is very dry area. Desert I would imagine. Mostly sand and very sharp drainage. Not like places with clay.
wrote:

Somewhere between zone 5 and 6 tucked along the shore of Lake Michigan on the council grounds of the Fox, Mascouten, Potawatomi, and Winnebago
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Well in opal mining parts of Australaia where it is bothe extremely drya and extremely hot, some of the miners live underground in houses called 'dug outs' I know that some tress have been planted and grown in 'underground' gardens. I've sen pics of them but can't find any online reference to them. What they look like at ground (or more correctly, at ndnerground level which is how it's seen from the house) is a normal tree with trunk. At the abobve groudn level it looks like a tree canopy. Effectivley, the tree is growing in a hole with it's canopy showing at 'real' ground level.

It can be done and really the pics of the trees I've seen of the treed growing in these hot dry deep holes are not at all etiolated - just growing well in a place where they should not be able to grow at all because the conditions are just too darned harsh.
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On Sun, 14 Oct 2012 13:41:26 +1100, "Farm1"

This is very interesting. What sort of trees are these, and do they need special treatment to keep alive?
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I remember that one was a lemon but I can't recall what the others were. The lemon was grown in a smaller hole than the others. No special treatment was given except the fact that they were grown in the hole (by which I mean a HUGE hole because it becomes part of the courtyard area of the underground house). Hole growing givves the house shade once the canopy gets up and allows the tree to be cared for.
It's hard to convery why this could work or how it's done unless you have some idea of the harshness of the opal mining areas of Australia. Do a google on 'opal mining towns Australia' in google images and you'll see what the landscape is like.
i worte here a few weeks ago aobut a man I know who grows grapes in what he calls "sun pits". He grows his grapes liek that because its' too cold where he lives to grown them in the open. In his case, he just dug 2 huge trenchs into the ground on north facign slopes (north to get sun orientation because this is the sthn hemisphere). these trenchs were aobt 6 ft deep and he topped that with Laserlite type corrugated roofing sheets which sometimes collapsed when kangaroos jumped on them. His 'sun pits' give similar protection to the grapes as would be gained for anyone growing trees in huge holes.
I still haven't been able to find any specific pics, but the first one (which isn't from Australia but will give you and indication of the size of the hole I have seen pics of). If you think about a tree canpopy appearing from holes of this size you may understand I'm writing about: For this one scroll down to the pic with the sentence starting 'about 150 kms away...' http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?fA&t 872 Here's a cite that talks about general living conditions in opal mining areas. I fyou take note of the above ground te,mps and those in a dugout, you should see why a tree would prefer to grow in a hole in such a place: http://www.grumpytraveller.com/2012/09/23/coober-pedy-south-australia-opal-mine-tours-show-homes /
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On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 12:35:27 +1100, "Farm1"

Where do they get water in these places. Are there deep wells?
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We have such underground gardens here in California. Google: Forestiere underground gardens photos.
Baldasere Forestiere from Sicily created the home and gardens in Fresno CA, over a 40 year period. Fascinating!
Emilie
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In the desert SW of USA the buildings are called Kivas altho they arent entirely underground. I think you are looking for http://www.undergroundgardens.com/amazingfacts.html

Somewhere between zone 5 and 6 tucked along the shore of Lake Michigan on the council grounds of the Fox, Mascouten, Potawatomi, and Winnebago
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'Farm1[_4_ Wrote: > ;970801']Well in opal mining parts of Australaia where it is bothe > extremely drya and

>

> 'underground'

On Easter Island, gardens are planted in deliberately dug depressions too. The reason in this case is mainly to protect them from the wind. You can grow bananas and avocadoes and stuff like that if you grow them in a hole, but not on the surface. But these are sunken gardens, not individual holes for each plant. The island is extremely well drained because it is mostly permeable lava.
On Lanzarote (Canary islands) vines are grown in little depressions with a wall on the windward side.
I've also seen, indeed stayed in, underground buildings with sunken courtyards in Tunisia. They were used for filming sequences in Star Wars.
--
echinosum


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http://www.undergroundgardens.com/amazingfacts.html
Forestiere Underground Gardens

Somewhere between zone 5 and 6 tucked along the shore of Lake Michigan on the council grounds of the Fox, Mascouten, Potawatomi, and Winnebago
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"Horticulturist Fruit trees planted at different levels blossom at different times, usually within two weeks of each other, thereby lengthening the growing season. Underground trees are also protected from the frost.
Forestiere planted numerous varieties of fruit-bearing trees and grapevines underground including: orange, lemon, grapefruit, sour orange, sweet lemon, loquat, kumquat, quince, date, mulberry, carob, pomegranate, strawberry, jujube, almond, and fig. Grape varieties included Alicante, Thompson, Muscat, Grenache, Black Morocco, and Zinfandel.
Most of the citrus trees he grafted bear three or more varieties of citrus fruit. One tree was grafted to bear seven varieties: valencia, navel, and bittersweet oranges, ponderosa and sweet lemons, grapefruit, and an Italian citron called cedro (pronounced chedro).
Many trees and vines are close to 100 years-old and still produce fruit!"
On Tue, 16 Oct 2012 09:05:09 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@wi.rr.com wrote:

Somewhere between zone 5 and 6 tucked along the shore of Lake Michigan on the council grounds of the Fox, Mascouten, Potawatomi, and Winnebago
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