Re: Lowering PH



Pay no attention to the cranky, wannabe chemist Bill, Tippy.
To actually lower the soil PH thereby making it more acid, as noted in your subject line, leaf mulch/mold and sawdust are good additives. Sulphur will also get the PH down. Ask for it at your local nursery and follow the directions on the package.
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in article phaedrine snipped-for-privacy@news-50.giganews.com, Phaedrine Stonebridge at phaedrine snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote on 8/11/03 8:55 PM:

What did I suggest that was incorrect? Is it only my refusal to be a green quack?
Bill
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She asked a simple, line-sentence question so the rocket science lecture......
"If you do not understand chemistry well enough to figure it out for yourself, get someone who knows to help. It is not, as is said, rocket science."
...... was way out of line. I was telling her to ignore your arrogant crankiness in case she was new and decided to never come back after being treated so rudely.
As far as not being a "green quack", I have no idea what you are talking about. That others have taken offense at your attitude hardly surprises me.
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Repeating Decimal wrote:

From one Bill to another: I can do the chemistry just fine. However, I can also do the che mistry 'nearly enough' with organic materials. Because organic materials a id the tilth of my soil and give the microbial activity a boost, I choose or ganic. Could you explain why, since they do not help the tilth of your s oil or boost your microbial activity, you continue to espouse synthetic ch emical means of gardening?
Bill
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in article snipped-for-privacy@axilla.wwnet.net, Noydb at snipped-for-privacy@organic-earth.com wrote on 8/12/03 10:08 PM:

I have nothing against the so called "organic" methods espoused by you or chemically deprived Phaedrine Stonebridge. I have objection to raising these methods to a level of religious zeal.
For me, it is much easier to use so called chemicals. I do not have the strength or time to get horse manure and roto-till it into my adobe hardpan. I do what I can. I guess according to some people there are no chemicals in manure or compost.
I like hydroponics. Is it less green for the world as to use simple inorganic chemicals than to use oodles of ever more difficult to get water?
I just picked my first hydroponicly grown banana squash. It was absolutely delicious. I will post more on the subject. I would stack that squash against any "organically" grown squash.
Bill
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I challenge you to find a single instance where I gave anyone here a hard time about the use of ANY garden treatment including chemicals.
You won't find it because I never said any such thing.
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On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 20:52:53 GMT, Repeating Decimal

----- Hydroponics is very interesting as I've worked with tomatoes in climate controlled greenhouses. It's VERY productive, but still quite expensive; or at least it is in Tucson as water is costly as are our summer season electricity rates for the evaporative cooling fans.
But we do have great levels of natural sunshine which many parts of the world can't match!
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Repeating Decimal wrote:

The water cycle works just as well as it always has. There is still plenty of water. The difference is that now we have to filter the human manure, pesticides and industrial by-products out of it before we can drink it again. Ask the citizens of India what they think of the idea of using Lindane in their fields just now.
My compost does not, so nearly as I can tell, contribute to the befouling of our water supplies. Indeed, since it can hold up to 900% of its weight in water (vs 2% for sand, 20% for clay), it can be argued that it represents a major conservation of it. A heavily composted soil retains water better than a strictly mineral soil and makes nutrients much more readily available to the plants than a mineral soil. I have added nothing to my soil this year. Nothing, that is, except compost as a mulch and water as needed. It is mid-August and I have one bed that has been hose watered only twice. The others recieve weep irrigation (at a rate of about 1 pt. per foot per day) using Irrigro tyvek lines (now on their second year). That's actually more water than I think they need, but it's difficult to adjust the pressure to less since the city supply line pressure fluctuates quite a bit. I think they could get by on about 1/2 the amount they are getting.
Grow your garden anyway you want. I don't consider myself 'chemically deprived'. If anything, it is the users of chemicals who are deprived. I'll match my yields and flavor against anyones and then we can compare the costs of production per unit. My wallet doesn't feel deprived at all.
Adobe succombs to post-hole composting in which a series of post holes are power augured and then backfilled with compostable material (horse manure is only one of a long list of possible materials: see http://www.jenkinspublishing.com/humanure.html ). When the holes are nearly full, they are capped with adobe, making, over time, a raised bed that is actually quite fertile and parsimonious of water.
Organic gardening in the desert requires more thought. Not more labor. I have never waded through horse manure while following a rototiller and I wouldn't suggest that anyone else do it, either. If you live in horse country, someone has an augur to lend / rent. Put 6" dia. holes on 12" spacings (offset the rows for a 12" diagonal spacing) as deep as you can get the augur to go. The soil critters will drill through the adobe to get from one posthole to another ... and leave their tunnels behind. You could 'seed' the first hole or two with a handful of local earthworms if you don't think you have enough in your own soil.
Bill
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in article snipped-for-privacy@axilla.wwnet.net, Noydb at snipped-for-privacy@organic-earth.com wrote on 8/15/03 5:36 PM:

So what? I do not have riperian rights to any

My hydroponic nutrient solution also do not contribute pollution. True, I live near the ocean where the minerals can seep. But that is not the pollution that deserves the complaint. After the use to grow plants, the waste solution is applied to soil plants. The major loss of water is plant transpiration and evaporation.

The problem is that I do not want to rent a horse or haul horse tailings in my vehicle. I have composted tree trimmings and have no complaint against it.

I have indeed thought of drilling about two feet through the adobe but haven't done so. Hydroponics is just fine--for me.

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