A couple of questions about gas pipe installation.

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1. Do I have to have a CORGI registered plumber to replace a gas hob which has a bayonet hose connection, with a new gas hob? I'll just be reconnecting with the bayonet connection and not touching the pipework in any other way.
2. Is it ok to run gas pipes under floorboards. The reason I ask is that when I rerouted a gas pipe through a cavity wall I sleeved it in PVC pipe as per regs so that there could not be a build up in the cavity should a leak occur. But, I've seen gas pipes run under ground floor and first floor floors and I would say there's as much chance of a gas build up there. So, is it ok to run them under floorboards?
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I have a gas pipe running under my ensuite floor
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clangers snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

No - but the Plumb Center may refuse to sell you the bayonet pipe if you are not Corgi registered [1] - but some of the 'sheds' will happily sell you one without a query!

No problems there - just remember where the pipe is if you have to re-nail a squeaking floorboard. :-)
[1] I have a theory that the storeman in this particular depot is running a bit of a scam with a mate to install cookers etc whenever a 'grey haired old wrinkly' asks for such an item - when I asked him to quote me the particular part of the regs stopping the sale of such items to non-Corgi registered customers he couldn't answer me.
And neither did the Customer Support at the Plumb Center head office respond to my e-mail asking the same question - and I asked very politely on both occasions I may add. :-)
Tanner-'op
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Plumbase were running ads in the trade publications a few months ago, stating they wouldn't sell gas components to non-Corgi registered customers. They don't have to sell you something if they don't want to.
Plumbase charge extortionate amounts for non-trade account customers, as much as they think they can get you to part with,; this includes non-gas components. Ghastly rip-off merchants. Get it from Scewfix.
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Onetap wrote:

I fully accept that - but when I know more about a subject than a 'snotty nosed' storeman who has yet to shave the first signs of 'bum-fluff' off his face, it gets a bit annoying - expecially when you try to explain the phrase "competent person" to him!
As a matter of fact, I simply jumped in the car and went to an independent plumbing suppliers (who *know* what they are talking about and got the part with no problems.
Out of interest, I was collecting the pipe for my son - who has an HNC in mechanical engineering, works in the electronics industry travelling worlwide, and just 'happens' - as part of his job - to work with gases that if released into the atmosphere can kill in seconds.
So I would have thought him more than competent to fit a simple bayonet ended, flexible pipe carrying natural gas!

I was 'in building the trade' from 1964 to 2001 - it just happens that this particular Plumb Center is within walking distance - and I really need the exercise.

I know of better, local places than Screwfix to get most of my supplies from - and with some amazing discounts that Screwfix will not give.
Tanner-'op
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On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 11:59:52 +0100, Tanner-'op wrote:

So how does working with gases which "if released into the atmosphere can kill in seconds" have anything to do with working with gases which are burned to produce heat, in appliances the installation and commissioning of which is subject to entirely different regulations? It's like saying that someone with expertise in handling poisons is automatically qualified in food safety.
It seems clear that you have no idea of the other factors which have to be taken into account besides fitting the hose - or indeed whether it is legal to fit a hose in the circumstances the OP describes. I just hope your son has more clue.
--
John Stumbles

My karma ran over my dogma
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I found this reply to the same question on Yahoo answers here: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid 071007031427AA2WfZk
No, legally you cannot remove the cooker yourself, even if it is a bayonet fitting, you have to leak test (which should not be done with detergent or soap, that is illegal), if there is a leak, you have to be able to test the metre, repair the leak and test the metre again, (the bayonet should really be removed anyhow if the present occupiers are moving out, and the pipe capped), when the cooker is re-installed, if there is no bayonet, one has to be fitted, so the metre has to be tested there too, anti tilt mechanism also has to be installed, clearances to sides and height have to be checked, then the cooker pressure tested and the thermostat and safety devices have to be checked. Know what i am talking about? No? Neither do a good half of your previous answerers. Rant over, sorry but I get annoyed with people on here who are quite willing to put lives at risk by giving wrong answers for the sake of 2 points.
He seems to be saying it's a definite no no. Any comments on his answer?
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clangers snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

Might be worth putting that in quotes - for a moment it sounded like you getting out of your pram! ;-)
Point worth noting at this point in case you were not aware both John S and Ed who have responded to parts of this thread are CORGIs.
To address specific points in the above - yes many of them are technically correct as I understand it (but note I am not CORGI). You should leak test after remove or reinstatement. As a minimum this should be with a proper leak test spray, or preferably by doing a full pressure drop test with a manometer at the test point on the meter. Bayonet fittings are not intended for long term isolation and hence should be capped when not in use. Anti tilt device etc should be present as previously discussed.
In addition there are a bunch of regulations regarding appliances like cookers, especially wrt to the ventilation and air volume requirements. Clearances will also be specified by the manufacturer.
On a more practical level, whether it is right or wrong to disconnect a bayonet fitting yourself is a moot point, since you chances of getting a CORGI out to do just that are going to be slim.
--
Cheers,

John.

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clangers snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

Well he would do, he's been corgi registered for 28 years. As has been pointed out, it's competance, not registration that you want to worry about. Many Corgi registered fitters fail the competance test.
As a house-owner, I'm *far* more concerned about any small leaks than a "hit'n'run" gas fitter and consequently have my own manometer for leak testing. Of course there's more to fitting a hob than leak testing and it's possible that regulations may have changed since your last hob was fitted so you can't necessarily assume that a straight swap will meet regs.
Tim
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On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 05:14:10 -0700, clangers_snout wrote:

You can remove the cooker yourself (e.g. for cleaning): that's what the bayonet connector is there for.
Apart from that (and the spelling) the quoted advice is connect with respect to (re)installing a cooker.
--
John Stumbles

What do you mean, talking about it isn\'t oral sex?
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You may only connect your new hob to a flexible hose if permitted in the manufacturers instructions, otherwise you must use hard pipework .

Yes you can run gas pipes under floors.
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Also one reason you sleeve the gas pipe through a wall is to protect the copper from mortar attack.
Adam
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I was walking through a residential area on Sunday. Noticed loads of fairly recent combi installations; classic copper gas pipe round the outside, flues of various types, and a bit of pressure relief pipework. I probably saw well over 50 on a wide variety of houses and flats (would be lots of different installers), and not a single one had the gas pipe sleaved - all just mortared around (or in some cases, not even that). Is this something CORGI inspectors never check?
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
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writes:

Obviously not. The rules are clear though.
Page 172 of the Domestic Natural Gas Handbook 4 says "All pipes that pass through a wall or floor of a building must be sleeved. This applies to all walls not just load bearing walls. (Gas Safety (Installation & Use) Regulations. Part D Regulation 19 (2b))
The sleeve should be sealed 1) Between the sleeve and the brickwork 2) On the inside between the sleeve and the pipe, with fire resistant mastic. The sleeve should normally be sealed at one end only, preferably to open air, where applicable. In the case of meter boxes the sleeve should be sealed at the point of entry to the building.
Adam
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writes:

And if a BG service flagged up the problem BG would be shot to shit on this newsgroup:-)
Adam
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On Mon, 09 Jun 2008 02:01:17 -0700, clangers_snout wrote:

No, but you have to be competent which means: You'll know that in all cases (except where the manufacturer explicitly states you /must/ use a bayonet connector) you will be dispensing with the connector and using rigid pipework.

Yes but the method is deprecated.
The reason I ask is that

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
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On Mon, 09 Jun 2008 20:24:42 +0000, Ed Sirett wrote:

Is it? Where?
I know there was some concern about pipes in inter-floor voids in new build with more air-tight construction but IIRC the bottom line was it's still OK.
--
John Stumbles

Fundamentalist agnostic
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I suppose it's because it might get punctured by a nail, etc. Far better to run it unprotected round an outside wall. ;-)
--
*I love cats...they taste just like chicken.

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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wrote:

I know (think) that was supposed to be sarcastic, but actually it probably *is* better to run it unprotected round an outside wall. It is more likely to develop a leak on an outside wall, but a small gas leak there will just disperse. Under a floor, it is less likely to develop a leak - but the potential damage if a leak /does/ develop is / much/ higher.
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On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 04:39:22 -0700 (PDT) someone who may be Martin

If those making such recommendations are willing to pay for the gas which such a leak entails then fine. If they expect the householder to pay for the gas then that is different.
--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
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