Re: Rip the Ripper



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I'm with you there.
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From my perspective, it's not about royalties etc., it's about putting the time, effort, creativity, etc. into composing or writing something, and then having someone else copy it, and claim it as their own. It only adds insult to injury if they turn around and make money from it.
If I give someone free copies of my compositionsm or writings, that's one thing, but I don't like the idea of them turning around and giving free copies to the entire world. DIstribution ought to be up to me. But even that would be passable as long as I got attribution. Copyright used to be about attribution (or, at least, that's what I'd thought...) More an dmore, it's about money - as is pretty much everything else =:-p
I can deal with the idea of royalties, but mostly because I tend to favor artsts who are not making mega-millions in the recording industry. Ironically, the people who create the largest legal waves about it all are the people who make thousands of dollars a week (or *day*).
At the same time, people do buy MP3s, so not all of them are illegal. IF they start arresting people merely for having MP3 players, it'd be a real mess, separating legal owners from the rest...

As above, personally, I'd be most concerned about attribution, of giving credit where credit is due.
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Kris Krieger wrote:

> it.
Seriously considering undertaking anything in a complex and dynamic world would seem to inspire a few more perspectives, if only to, ideally, get a better handle on reality.
And what if everyone knew that making copies and $ from your work was a possibility? Would that change anything and, if so, how, why and for whom, etc.?

You don't have to like it, but if you're going to, say, compose music and stockpile all your notation in open-air, unlocked buildings in every town around the world, the wind is going to blow it all about, and some people are going to pick it up and do something with it-- maybe sell them as-is; do live shows with them; or compose original scores, as inspired by them. What fun!

If it were, I might never get to discover, enjoy, and be inspired by your work. That kind of dynamic, it is argued, is what enriches creativity and culture more than keeping everything under lock & key.
BTW, I seem to suddenly recall enjoying one or two of your compositions. Keep it up-- and online. :)

Google "Luxuriousity". ;D
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I explained in the paragraphs below.

No, that is still my choice.
I don't oppose personal enjoyment. I also am not necessarily opposed to copies, as long as attribution is kept with the work.
Selling is another matter. It just seems a bit unethical to me to sell someone else's work.
It's sort oflike the GNU licensed programs. THey're free, but only with the understanding that they won't be 'relabelled' and sold.
A different thing is only charging for the CD and postage. It costs a certain amount to buy a CD, package it, and mail it. But that is not 'selling the work", that's just saying, "I'll mail you this neat stuff if you send me enough to cover the packaging and mailing".
Which, of course, is why I'm not, and never will be, rich - I don't see life as one big money-making opportunity. Rather than thinking, "Oh, hey, I can sell this work", I'm mroe like, "Oh, hey, glad you liked, it, come over for a burger, it'd be great if you could pick up a six of beer and bring it..."
People don't think 'm like that, because I don't communicate well in person. Thank goodness, ebcause fI have the unfortunate habit of being a bit easy to take advantage of <LOL!>

But I never said anything about keeping things under lock and key.

Well, if I can keep Windows from crashing long enough to get more work done on my website, and then upload the thing... =:-o
I haven't composed in a long time, tho'. I go through phases. I guess it'd also help if I empty out th emoving boxes that are on top of the keyboard...<AHEM...> Actually, I'm fibbing, I can't play worth beans and tend to "build" music. Most typically, I'l dream something, and then try to reconstruct it if I remember it after waking up. Long process. Second most typical, I jsut "hear" something in my head and then try to build or reconstruct it. Also tedious. I need programs that just read my mind directly! OTOH, that might end up being more like "Chiller Theater" <LOL!>

Arrrrgh!!! Some people...
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Agreed.
You could sell support for the product too, or a password that allows access to music or software updates.

If the burger was decent-- maybe on a crusty French bun, and you offered white wine Dijon mustard, fresh tomatoes, onions, leaves of spinache and gourmet olive-oil-mayo, and maybe some deli-style cole-slaw to go along with it, I'd consider the beer.

Well, we all have our off-days in that regard, which I suppose can fluctuate from individual-to-individual.

Then a gourmet burger it is... I'll be expecting my plane seat-reservation by mail... A 4-star for 2 nights should be fine.

Oh ok, good. You had me worried there for a minute.

My cracked Photoshop keeps quitting on me! I'm trying to learn the GIMP, I really am! ;)

Me neither... I spent some time a couple of nights ago researching professional-quality external sound-cards with surprisingly little headway. Turtle Beach? Creative Labs? Anyway, I'll have to keep looking. I'm sure they're out there.

That's fine, and is kind of what I do too, although I can still play rudimentarily, if that's a word. Listening to all this fine online open source electronic music from different countries is beginning to get me wanting to get back into the groove again-- this time with a laptop. Last time, it was with an Ensoniq SQ80, a Korg Poly 800 and Fostex X15.

Really? That's different... although, sometimes when I wake up, I have these terrible and cheesy tunes in my head that I sometimes whistle out loud to get them out... the kind maybe that a kid, their grandmother and a children's tv show executive might get together and create.

Do they serve iced lattes? I wouldn't mind experimenting with some software that I've heard supposedly composes by itself, based on fractal and other algorithms I think. I could take the bits I liked and merge and layer them with other bits. I like the idea of music that morphs, yet stays true to its basic idea. Consider, as a small, simple example, having a snare drum sound that changes per beat, rather like how it would be if someone replaced the drummer's snare drum before each subsequent strike with another snare of a different make, model and maybe tightness.

If or when I get back into music composition and recording, I might throw some my pieces out anonymously and for free "just for the thing of it". However, attribution for the most part might be preferrable. (Maybe I can in some way voice-mark each song.)
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Music updates...? I don't see how that would work. But for GNU software, as an example, you can just go to teh webiste to get any updates. A software update would mean additional code, and part of the GNU license (since we're talking about free distribution) is that nobody can turn around and sell updates/code alterations. If someone wants to sell software, tehy have to write their own.
SO, for music, I could deal with somehting like the GNU license. Similar thing to a lot of JavaScript snippts - if you use someone's script, you're supposed to incldu eattribution in a Comments section of your HTML source code.
Support would prob be differnt, because what you are actually sellingis your own knowledge/skill (and time spent acquiring it).

Jeez, pickyu picky! <LOL!>
I make my own mustard... No mayo or vinegar, either, sorry ;)

I've been diagnosed with Asperger's. Personally, I think there is far too much "syndromization" of what IMO are merely natural human differences, but it's easier for most people to wrap their minds around a syndrome, than it is for them to merely accept the fact that nto all people are identical - IOW that we're individual human beings, not ants (well, at least, not ALL of us ;) !)

<LOL!> Not THAT easy! ;)

Nah. I don't *seek* public exposure (no comments from the peanut gallery...), but I also don't fear it. SOme peopl ehave liked some of my stuff (music and writings), some have hated some of it. It's liek anything else, tho' - beauty is in the eye (or ear ;) ) of the beholder, and it's not a huge ego thing for me if someone doesn't like something. I actually like true critiques, because they help me to improve. What does bother me is simple/simplistic disparagement, such as "that's stupid", but it doesn;ty bother me becuase my ego gets bruised, it bothers me because such statements say nothing about the work and everything about the person making the meaningless statement (IOW, it's a waste of time to even hear it).

Heh!
THe whole topic is IMO a quagmire. I recall something called "Oxygen" tat is suppsoed to be top-notch, or at least, was top-notch a few years back. What ties me up is not the sound card as much as the mechanics of mixing and format and so on. Heck, I've been trying to figure out how th eheck to simply save my MIDI files as MP3 files... I'd gotten some software that said it'd save t MP3, btu all it saves is bleep-bleeped bleeper-bleeping CD rips. I have no interest in ripping CDs, I want to MAKE CDs. Most of the advice I've gotten seems to inviolve the purchase of about $3K of equipment...it's insane.
I haven't looked into playing and recording, then integrating that into MIDI files, because I've lost my ability to play - I used to play Classical guitar, and quite well to be honest, but that was many years ago. So I only compose in the computer. What do you do? Perform and record, compose, ...? ANything posted online? I'd be interested in giving it a listen. I like exapmpels of most things, tho' to be honest, I'm not a fan of the vast majority of rap. And Country is not one of my favorites. Aside form that, I'm pretty eclectic in my tastes, and will give any music a chance.

I think it is, but that's not reliable ;)

THat's beyone my vocabulary, to be honest. I just use a Creative card - teh one in htis machine is an Audigy 4, which I got because ti's suppsoed to be capable of carrying more voices - some of my mroe "dense" ditties would "skip" on my old Sound Blaster Live.
ANything mroe expensive is dicey, because I'm not makingmoney off of any of this, and things such as hosehold expenses and retirement savings ceom in first, second, third, and fourth above hobby expenses ;) But if I ever won the Lottery (assuming I ever remember to buy a ticket <L!>), I'd look into getting something that I could use to create good-quality CDs.

I dunno, esp. since I'm actually not completely sure what it is that makes a Latte, a latte... Yes, it's true, I'm a Coffeegnoramus...

SUre, why not! One thing I've done is jot down (so to speak) snippets that cross my mind, and save them. THere was one bit that i saved for about 9 years before I finally got an inspiration re: what to do with it.
You never know.
OTOH, I've played with the graphic version of something similar (inmage effects), and the potential pitfall is getting so entranced by the "little pretties" that one is sidetrackied away from actually creating.

In a way, that's the concept of "theme and variations". Jazz and Classical both use that a lot - the composer starts with something, and then morphs it, yet retains a recognizable core/characteristic throughout.

It's been a while since I've checked, but IIRC, there was a company called Koan that put out software thatd encrypt your music file, which could then only be played back with their player. THe player was free and had a very small footprint, so it wouldn't be a big deal for people to download.
However, also IIRC, Cakewalk software allows you to embed comments into your MIDI (??and MP3??) files.
Im not overly-egotistical, but I *am* egotistical enough so that I'd want attribution <G!>
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If your music were like GNU software, you would put it out there for free, other people would take it for free, and if they changed it, they would provide you with the changes. And people could charge for the CD burning and the "support" for the product. You would basically be giving away free copies to the entire world, and would be saying "here world make it better if you can, just let me know what you did, and make sure my name is on it".
--
Edgar



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That's sort of what I said...
At the same time, I won't pretend that I wouldn't like some $$ if I could get it <LOL!>
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Oh, playing is great, no doubt about that, but composing is a different facet of it. Beethoven composed even after he went deaf, which made playing irrelevant.

It's an extension of the self, of, if you will, the soul. IMO, at least. When you get good with something, it's like having an extra hand, but better. THat's how it'd be to fly, and that's how music is. I used to play a lot more, and keep thinking that some day, I'll save up and get myself an oboe (a good oboe). THat was great, it was like singing, except better, since I couldn't sing all that well ;) Guitar is also great. Well, ANY musical instrument is.
It also helps keep your mind sharp, yoru fingers moving, and your heart young :)
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My wife does that. She calls it typing. Come to think of it...millions of other people do it too..all day , every day.
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At first I wasn't sure whether "musical memory" referred to playback (where one can hear, instrument by insturment, a piece with which one is familiar, to the point of forgetting that, no, the radio/stereo is *not* on, it's playing in the mind...), or referred to "direct connect", where it seems to go from eye to finger regardless of what the mind is doing or where it might be wandering off to.
I never got that fast, not even close, but I used to be ableot play some rather complex chords (I played Classical, not Rock). Similar thing with Oboe after a while.
((So why the heck is my typing os dismal...I could never figure it out...must be those numbers and letters that look backwards or seem to be other than what they are...))
Anyhoo, it's fun when it ahppens. Very meditative.

Exhilerating :)

IF you keep up with playing, yup, it can get like that.

THat's what I was going to reply until I realized that you already said it.
I find it irritating when people kvetch about someone "zoning out" merely because that person is in a place that is not he everyday mundane "did you see 'Friends' last night" dumbass bullshit plane of what pathetically passes as an excuse for "reality".
IMO, the times when one can transcend the petty stupidities are to be cherished as a blessing.
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Don wrote:

I think there are some controllers available for extra expressivity that goes beyond a keyboard-- including some kinds of "guitar".

There's something limiting about requiring just your arms, hands and fingers to get the music you want.

I'm inclined to agree.

A Theremin? ;)
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"Don"

A foot pedal? Well that's one thing, but I was thinking more along the lines of digital controllers.
AFAIK, you can get all kinds of digital input systems, (including guitar-controllers), that control your computers' sound/music systems with the same or approximate expressiveness as you are with your choice of instrument, alone, with the instrument being as natural as your vocal chords or whistles.
I don't know about you, but I like to think I can replicate practically any guitar virtuoso with my whistling or vocals. Bung that into a physical modelling computer music system, where, say, an electric guitar is modelled, and you might have something somewhat resembling what you can do along your real guitar.

The above might be akin to an industrial-strenth "kazoo" without the kazoo. :)

The thing is, if you can already run, dance, whistle, hum, sing, or make silly faces at babies, you could tap into that and use it to control your sound, music, and even minute elements of them.

What about a guitar controller/midi guitar and/or something like the above? Technique is one thing, but composition and soul is another. Technique without soul don't count for much.

Come again?
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Some are sensitive to pressure and, what its it called, I can't recall now, where you rock your finger back and forth on a sting (guitar, violin, etc.) to create slight variations in pitch, sometimes called IIRC "vibrato".
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Your last paragraph makes me think that you DO in fact actually get Jazz :-)
--
Edgar



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