Re: OT: Thinking about design

Page 1 of 2  


Hey Ken. Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and keeping things stowed away. You should also look at the old style chest tool boxes with the movable tills.
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
[snipped]

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor heating systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are embedded in concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it more acessible if repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some larger hosing to either (1) create a channel into which the actual hoses/piping could be laid, and then have somewhat-raised flooring put on top, or (2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


I never thought of in-floor heating on a second floor that isn't concrete (as in a non-low-rise apartment building), to be honest - I've only ever seen it embedded in concrete, so, if a repair has to be done, it's not just that the floor has to be torn up, a concrete salb floor has to be torn up.
But I thought that, if a channel could be made in the concrete and the hot- water hosing just laid in, and then if the floor on top could be on raised panels (to insure there was no contact between the flooring and the hot hosing/piping), then, if the system needed repair, there'd be no tearing at all so to speak, you just lift up the floor panels.
Would that not work...?
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Contact between the hot pipe and the concrete is how the heating energy is transferred. Your system would cost more to operate as the heat transfer would be less efficient.
Cutting open a slab and repairing some PEX would cost a grand or less, and with thermal imaging locating the leak is not that difficult. Your redundant piping idea would have some benefits, some disadvantages and would cost more than a repair that might never need to be done.
You are suggesting designing a system because you expect it to fail.
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

The holes would have frozen too. The solution was heat tape on a thermocouple and a solar panel with battery. Or, just bury the dam thing 4' down and be done with it. I know, I know, Ditch Witch rental is $75/hr but when you wanna run with the big dawgs......
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Yes, it would *work* but not the way you want it to. You are not considering the principle of radiant heat.
The PEX with hot water running though them heats the surrounding cementitious material and after a spell continues to radiate the heat into the room. Radiant heat if different than the other forms of heat you are probably more familiar with.
When the PEX is embedded inside the concrete it is effectively inside a conduit, just like regular PVC water piping is. If the pipe breaks, so what?, its inside another pipe made of concrete.
When PEX is installed on a 2nd floor that is constructed of wood it is secured to the wood subfloor with the proper channels and then a layer of light weight concrete is poured over top, again, embedding the PEX inside the concrete.
If you want to heat the air in a room a $20 space heater will do that, but when it cycles off the air quickly cools. If you want to heat the room and the things in the room that is where radiant heat shows its stuff.
And then there's electric radiant floor heat but thats a whole nuther animal.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
RicodJour wrote: > Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house design. Poke around this page and you'll see what I mean: http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water. It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
RicodJour wrote:

There are buildiings that take their inspiration from boats or ships. Here is one of the most famous, the Balat [name of a district] Ahrida Synagogue in Istanbul, for which see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahrida_Synagogue_of_Istanbul * The bema is in the shape of a ship and other parts of the interior are reflective *
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

And you could probably tow one behind a compressed-air car or tuktuk (thinking ahead beyond peak oil?)
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Does anyone make those anymore?
Can a small car pull one?
I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a. avoid hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are - I'm not at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but after seing some of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought it'd be a great way to sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy structure, *but* without having to spend a fortune on some super-techno monster that you need a 3-ton truck to haul around.
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty inside. Or are they...? I don't know anything about them, really. I like the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'd also liek a small shower/toilet.
What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made for long-haul truckers. I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I have too many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great little camper.
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

People have pulled the things with their Harleys. Pretty much any car can pull a teardrop.
Some of them have a porta potty and it wouldn't be too much work to rig up a shower curtain hanging from the rear hatch.
Here's one guy that hooked up a car engine heated shower: http://www.nicksteardrop.com/spamboree5.htm
Store-bought version that takes a car with a little more oomph: http://www.roamingtimes.com/rvreports/tab-teardrop-trailer.aspx
And here's where you can ask specific questions and say "wow" alot: http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5978&start=0&sid=15ea6f759d5a8af8d20730e7485c5e28
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
[snip]

Hey, thanks for the links!
I just started thinking about this recently as a possible way of taking vacations after retirement - my idea of vcation being "let's explore teh Grand Canyon" as opposed to "let's go spend wads of $$ gambling and watching shows and going to overpriced bars".
Hmmm, who was it who'd posted pics here, I guess about a year ago, that he'd taken in Nevada, takin a day trip while the rest fo the family went to Las Vegas? That's the sort of thing I mean. A mini-trailer would be great for that.
The last link suggested a sit-down shower/bath, which would work fine for me. Main thing is just to be able to pour some hot water over myself, slather on the Cetaphil, and another pour to rinse off - nothing too fancy. The car-engine-heated water was clever ;)
I followed some of the links and it's interesting to see all teh plans for building one's own. I'll have to look to see whetehr tehre are instructions for fiberglass ones - that should make for a more lightweight item, yet still sturdy enough.
Anyway, interesting links, and inspirations for small-scale living :)
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Another possibility: http://www.puxtradingpost.com/product_info.php?cPath=43_74&products_id=230
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Also an intresting site :)
THanks!
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I thought those are sedans...?

There is some very fine-mesh stuff available these days :)

Yeah, it'd be nice to have the choice ;) .

My parents had one of those old VW Van campers. Now that was a neat littel thing. Main problem was that it was too narrow for the height, making it top-heavy. But I held onto the idea of something compact.
My aunt has some sort of mega-beast, with all of those motorized pop-outs, that requires a mega-truck to pull it, so now they can't aford to go anywhere becasue of the diesel prices. THat's not even remotely what I'm interested in.
I'm actually not a camper - I'm allergic to too many things :p to have gotten into it. But I'm thinking about something that'd basically be a place to sleep, while travelling to see various places, like the Grand Canyon or other national parks, monuments, and so on. I also like the idea of being able to prepare my own meals, given all the fat and salt and MSG and whatever that restaurant food is likely to have. I know, it sounds geeky, but there it is. At the same time, if you have a self-contained unit, you're less confined to specific geographical areas.
Anyhoo, some of those links Rico provided have furtehr links to plans and so on, so I'll have to give some thought to "living small" ;)
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Think of it more as "living large on a small scale".
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

THe interesting thing is how little useable room on egains with increased square footage. The rental house here was 2500 sq ft, and had a *huge* amount of built-in storage. THis place is 3200 sq ft, about the same closet space, less kitchen cabinet space, and little additional storage (soem shelves in the laundry room is the extent of it). The otehr, and even stupider, thing is that the entire area under the stairs is simply walled off - no access, no storage. It's goofy.
If I can ever have a place custom-designed, I want to be sure it uincludes lots of built-in storage. I'd ratherput stuff into a cabinet or closet or whatever, and shut the door, as opposed to having to buy (and maintain!) furnitrue just to store books and hobby materials and so on - it's kind of stupid IMO. And nonesense like "game areas" (i.e. open space they couldn't figure out what the heck to do with) just adds insult to injury so to speak.
I saw a program profiling several Tokyo designers,a dn what I liked was that walls weren't merely blank areas of nothing - walls were storage. MEaning, teh room itself didn't need to be all clogged up with furniture that has to be kept up with, because stuff was stored. The older I get (and the more ovten I move), the more I've come to hate furniture.
The key overall to a smaller space is storage, and organization. I've been in huge houses that "felt" small, becasue they were set up like rabbit- warrens; conversely, one of the most comfortable and "large" place I've lived was a 1500 sq ft house, becasue it had almost no hallways. Main thing was that it was 2 storeys, so it did need stairs, but the area under then was utilized (basement door) andthe overall floorplan was compact. OF course, it also only had a bath and a half - most Americans these days seem to "need" five bathrooms, and a master bath large enough to host a formal ball...
So that's the trick with smaller spaces - organization, and flow. Oh, and quality materials ;)
- Kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Movable storage systems are interesting. You've seen them in libraries and doctor's offices - there's no reason that similar, but more attractive versions, couldn't be used in residential construction. http://www.storageessentials.com/shop/filing+and+file+storage |223/
One of the houses at the Solar Decathlon last year had a movable wall between the bedroom area and the dining area. You rarely need both spaces at the same time.
R
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Interesting - I'd meant "moveable" as in, move from one house/city/state/country to another, however, that link opens some very interesting posibilities - if the mechanism could be fitted with materials/finishes more geared towards living areas, there are a great many possibilities.

That could be interesting if the dining room is very rarely used, but ti'd get annoying if one had to move itall every evening. Kind fo a mixed bag but, like everything else, it depends upon one's lifestyle. Personally, the last time I used a formal dining room as such was Decenmber of 1997 ;)
The whole idea of having a separate "formal" living room (which IMO ought to be re-named "visitor room" or even the old "salon", because nobody "lives", i.e. spends much time, in the "living room") are dicey in modest homes, where the "formal" rooms end up being space that's almost never used.
My personal preference would be to have some sort of mobile wall system around the kitchen - I donlt likea continually-open one because grease, noise,a nd odors jsut migrate too easily. So, I'd liket o be able to close it off while cooking (and have a super-powerful fume hood - most don't pull worth beans, *but* sound like a 747 at takeoff). If that could be done, you'd only need an eating area, becasue if you had visitors, they wouldn't have to go to the other end of the house so as to no look into the kitchen while dining - put down flooring that loks nice but is easy to maintain (i.e., *not* wall-to-wall carpeting), have a table/seating system that also is fairly easy to maintain and therefor can be also used for things other than just eating.
It just seems to me that there have got to be more adaptable solutions, other than just having a humongous house with a lot of seldom-used spaces that are very expensive to heat/cool.
ANyway, thanks for tthe moving-storage link, it's giving me some new ideas ;)
- kris
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.