Yes...taxes are an infringement. The Constitution (even as amended)
does not provide for 98% of what the government currently does...as a
result any tax money obtained to do that which the government has no
power (via the Constitution) to do, is stolen money to do illegal things
(this is not a discussion about those things being "good" or not, only
if there is Constitutional authority for the governemnt to do such things).
And again, you miss the point, liberty only works when individuals
self-impose restrictions on their behavior. And they must choose for
themselves to impose said restrictions. Anything else is slavery.
The Constitution doesn't address corporations, therefore the federal
government has no business making laws for or against them in any way.
That power was not granted to in the Constitution. That right was left
to the individual states. A federal court should have thrown out the
case because it had no jurisdiction over it.
Not if I kill you first... See the above.
Where does the responsibilty come from? What makes me wrong yell "Fire"
in a crowded theater? Oh...some guy in a black robe said that it's not
nice to the other people. What if I don't care about the other people?
"But you MUST care about the other people. It's not socially
responsible to NOT care. At least you can't endager their lives." Why not?
How about this...everyone minded their own business and was honest with
each other. What's the point of having police? What laws would we need
to have? And what environmental protections would "we" need?
In the end, which result would be better, having people properly govern
themselves or having more laws?
Don't be fooled that your license was about your safety or my safety.
It's about money to keep the license office people employed. Safety is
an excuse for the government to have "reason" to infringe on your liberty.
Though not related to this particular place in the thread, this actually
sounds exactly like my point. As you stated it "liberty only works when
individuals self-impose restrictions on their behaviour". As I stated it
"all freedoms come with responsibilities".
Your mother should have taught you these things. I don't mind the purely
philosophical and relativistic kind of discussion this is becoming, it can
be quite entertaining at times, but am not really interested ATM, nor with
someone who seems to actually apply that to his/her views on climate change
How about something in between? Besides, since people are clearly too
selfish to co-exist with out laws in some form or another, what you are
advocating is about as realistic as "from each according to his ability, to
each according to his needs"
That evil guberment, eh?
Where are you from? Wacko Texas?
No. But I am posting from sci.environment in a thread that started out
about global warming with a poster who denies it is a real thing, so I don't
like spinning that far into OT territory. I am not convinced he is sincere
in anything he has posted, particularily the bit I was directly responding
If I came off as dismissive, it is probably my fault. I used to love those
kinds of abtract conversations, but real life is just too damn intrusive...
Hmm..looking back, I want to restore the context and object to your
"What makes me wrong yell "Fire" in a crowded theater?" C'mon, what's his
point? Note he did not address my point at all nor did he reply to any of
the informative answers to scientific questions he raised in many other
points of this thread. He is just yanking my chain.
Property is theft.
Do you believe theft is right?
It is a yes or no question.
Why do you claim to own land? The ownership of land (ignoring a very
few odd cases) traces back to an act of violence. Doesn't yours?
Phil-hays at comcast.moc (remove moc and add net) should work for
That question is a classic for teaching that not all questions can be
answered "yes" or "no".
I'll guess you didn't know that.
Perhaps you might want to read this as well:
Uh..now I see how right you are Don. We don't need rules and laws to
curtail the freedom of people, they'll all do the right thing.
And to think I was actually trying to see your point of view. Oh, yeah, you
also said you were a good guy and we should just trust you to do no harm.
This email account has been deleted. You have destroyed its
usefulness to me. Do feel free to spread it around just as much as
you wish, you can't do any more harm. Really. Doesn't bother me.
It is charming, in the same way that a baby throwing food on the floor
is charming. So go ahead.
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